How does sabah election affect Suria?

Better pray that moratorium gets extended further. Dark cloud ahead..

It will eventually come back, unless all airlines went burst. Long-term players need to be patient.

There is only one party with that much shares to manage the buy/sell. no prize for guessing the right answer.

Posted by Nepo > Aug 16, 2020 8:32 AM | Report Abuse

Could u figure out what is happening to this share?

Cash per value is around RM 2.1, NTA is RM 2.85 but share price is RM 1.95

I was wondering who the hell is the seller sold at this price.

@observatory

You have raised a few interesting points and I do recommend you to subscribe to icap newsletter. Some questions for you to ponder on
1) Why is TTB almost fully vested in his overseas funds but opt to hold so much cash in icap? What's wrong with the Malaysia market?
2) For the other Malaysia equity fund, what is the degree of overlap with KLCI and what is ICAP's degree of overlap with KLCI?Note that we are comparing active funds and not index fund.
3) Baupost's cash position is 31% on Jun 30 and why? - I am a deep admirer of Klarman, more than buffett


The recent sharp rise in tomei and poh kong is like a slap on the face. It shows the irrationality of retail investors and the high level of speculative interest inside Bursa. I personally do not bother about KLCI.

might as well bet on Airasia than genting

@observatory
There are supporters and opponents to ICAP, not a big surprise.
The main arguments here revolve around two key points - big discount to NAV (what causes it?) and TTB's value investing methodology (whether it is still relevant today).
For the former, I believe it has got to do with COL and Laxey Partners. the price and vol trade in such a peculiar manner that they are the only "makers" in this counter.
For the latter, it is up to individual - every stock has its own risk/return profile. Some argue that they can generate higher return and my suggestion for them is to sell ICAP and look at other stocks. If you ever visit the AGM, most of the investors are retirees and they cannot afford to bet on counters like the glove makers. ICAP's portfolio is extremely defensive and I have personally added a few counters to my personal portfolio, on top of ICAP.

Where are the CoL supporters?
CoL has done two sizeable trades this week and manages to press down icap price.
"Thanks" for doing that.

icapital newsletter wrote on Airasia with a Buy call in its latest issue (last Friday).
Have to pay RM49 subscription for digital version.
https://www.icapital.biz/newsletter/home

@Quincy
icap newletter wrote on Airasia in its latest issue and the share price rocketed 21% today!!!
Its worth a read!

But the last quarterly report is on Nov 19. Even if icap released the end Feb 20 report, we will not know if icap increase or lower its cash holding during the MCO's low...

I am really puzzled.

Posted by fong7 > Jun 4, 2020 12:00 AM | Report Abuse

I guess we can just look at quarter reports to know ICAP cash holdings number.

Funny, I tot this thread is dead and it turned active all of a sudden...

For those who commented on TTB for not vesting, how do you'll know if he had increase or decrease his cash allocation? There is no announcement on Bursa. Can you'll enlighten me?

Posted by Quincy > May 8, 2020 9:16 AM | Report Abuse

@firehawk Your comment was made on 8 May 2020 and you cited icapital.biz Berhad's net asset value per share as at 25 March 2020.

lol

This is a gg counter

Malaysia market may go lower...

Quoting TTB: "China will bounce back from the Covid-19 even stronger than before. Mark his words."

Anyone agree/disagree?

Weak oil price+ poor property sales, higher provision for losses, lower interest rate environment - it is a tough time for banks

The market is ruthless, even Suria is not spared from the sell-off despite its stable business profile.

Frankly, TTB defended ICAP's NAV pretty well vs the broader market and many of the "experts" here. In this selloff, ICAP's portfolio fell less than 20% from its all-time high. Even if you invest in KLCI, your performance will be far poorer (the index is struggling to defend 1,300 points now vs its high of about 1865)

As of Nov 2019, ICAP has RM266 mln in cash or about RM1.90 per share. And if you'll follow ICAP's newsletter, TTB seems ready to enter the market at its low.

I have no idea what investors can ask for from TTB. He has delivered his promise to investors.

A monopoly... hope it is not implicated by the political tussle.

lolx... a purchase of 10K shares and you call it goreng...
then CLIM is??
And EPF and the other funds are???

Expensive Kopi...

And loser in the long term.

Coz i need to be smart like ahbah/ICap - to put $$ in FD over last 3 years and reduce exposure to stocks before market drops. ahteck85 is not that smart, most probably will lose $$ if I invest something else. Unless ahbah or ICap help me.

Malaysia retail is never easy, considering the large supply in the market. CMMT is interesting coz of its Penang asset.

Agree. An interesting counter with downside protection

Of course I have shares, if not, i wouldn't be bothered to look at this forum.
If you buy at the peak (at NAV premium), you have only yourself to blame. Who ask you to chase the stock.

Anyway, KLCI was down over the last 2-3 years. You must be damn smart to forecast that market will fall and invest your $$ in risk-free FD. I can also talk with hind-side bias.

Also, ICAP did have quite a % of the fund in cash and equivalents, which is what you recommended. So, what's wrong? What do you propose ICAP to hold over the last 2-3 years?

If you are holding the stock since inception, you should be making money. How come you got nothing? Did you own any share to begin with?

At one point, you say ICAP has great NAV and London is drooling ... blah blah blah,, then you say you get nothing... what are you talking about?



ahbah "ttb did grow the NAV from RM 1 to RM 3.21 + 9sen paid dividends.
No complains from some of those who have been long term invested in this fund."

Great NAV ! Congratulations to ttb n co. London came, saw n their mouth salivate. Now London want to eat Rm 3.21. I also want a share of it !

ICAP makes your portfolio more diversified, without a doubt.

CharlesT, you think the market is not expensive? At least TTB follows the investment guideline set in the prospectus. OTB's investment style is not my cup of coffee and I hope TTB steers clear of it.

COL - a saviour? More like vultures. If they can get back NAV for their current investment, they will take the money and never look back. To think you look so highly on them.

stockraider, are you a few cards short of a full deck? Do you understand what I am talking about? I have already said that the dissolution is 5 years after 15th AGM. You cannot count is it?

CharlesT, RM8 mln is used to hire a fund management company, not a single person. It is also in line with the industry rate. Inside any conventional fund management, there are many departments like compliance, accounts, research, IT etc. If RM8 mln is expensive, you should go to Genting/Genting Malaysia page and question why Tan Sri Lim is paid a total of RM249 mln last year. That amount is paid to him alone and Genting Group had a bad year in 2018.

You can choose not to agree with TTB investment methodology and go for other counters. It is your right and more appropriate esp if you know what/how to invest. You can invest according to your risk appetite. But, not many people have the necessary knowledge or time to do so. It is more scary if these people punt on the wrong counters. I have seen people who were ill-advised by their brokers and lost their life-savings on speculative counters. You know how heart-wrenching it is to see them crying and asking for help...

ahbah, you can tell readers about the NAV discount for icap, but please dun misguide them. icap's NAV is still dependent on its underlying investments. It can fall or rise.

tonywong8, if what you have said is true, suria's share price should have spiked a long time ago. Is the counter undervalued for a long time or is there something that we have missed out?

CharlesT Just a simple question to ahteck85. .r u happy with yr inv in icap?
I previously own a small stake in Selangor Properties. The share price kept falling then but why didn't I sell? Maybe I am lucky and the company got privatised. I care about what the company has to offer to me and what I am paying for, not the share price movement. Disclosure - I do have a small stake in ICAP but it's not substantial.

CharlesT When i saw so many new ids here supporting ttb since last week i feel its a bit unsual loh...
I previously only read and can’t be bothered to comment. The fact that there are no supporters talking doesn’t mean that there are none. As I have said previously, there are two sides to a coin. Even if I do not like a counter, I will not be bothered to hog a forum and keep posting negative things there. I do not deny that I have implicit interest in ICAP but what about you? You have short position?

I have no idea about your intention and can’t be bothered either. In any case, if I were you, I will check if i3investor keep a record of my ip address and I will not post anything defamatory here, for obvious reason.

Till then, all the best to your postings. :)

at the AGM convened in the 5TH YEAR FOLLOWING the date of the AGM (year 15th), which obviously means the 20th year.

How I wish I could Bold/Highlight/Underline the content in CAPS.

If I had not chanced upon this statement, I (and many others) would have been misled by you'll.





CharlesT I suggested there are 2 options for all the shareholders comes 15 years anniversary

U make yr own choice...yr money yr call...lol
14/10/2019 9:40 AM

ahbah To Mr CharlesT,

All ICap investors want money !

Please tell us what to do if we all want 30% gain next year. Thank you, Sir.
14/10/2019 9:59 AM
14/10/2019 10:29 AM

CharlesT and ahbah, I did some research on icapital.biz and found this at page 46 of their IPO prospectus...

"Accordingly, the Articles of Association of icapital.biz contain provisions to the effect that at the annual general meeting to be held in the 15th year after the company is listed on Bursa Securities and the Company has not then been wound up, the Board shall, at the AGM to be convened in the 5th year following the date of the AGM provided the Company has not then been wound up and subject to the SC Guideline-CEF and any law then in force, propose an ordinary resolution that icapital.biz shall continue as a closed-end fund for a further period of 5 years following the date of such general meeting."

From the statement, the fund is to vote on an ordinary resolution on the 20th year whether to wind down or not.

Where did you'll get the impression on the 15th year? Is there any new resolution that has been passed to replace this? Kindly verify

Any legal expert here? Maybe I am a dotard and have misread it.

A counter that is not for the faint-hearted. Prefers to seat one side and eat popcorn..

Ahbab, if brick and mortar shops are dead-ducks, why did Alibaba and Amazon set-up/acquire physical stores? Why did George Quek from BreadTalk take a major stake in Taiwan department store chain Pacific Sogo recently? Do you know what is omnichannel strategy? Do you think the online retailers like Qoo10 are even profitable to start with? You are merely citing obvious trends with no substantial knowledge about the industry and the forces around it. If all shoppers are shopping online non-stop, Mid-Valley and Pavilion should be empty!

There are always two-sides to a coin. We can measure icap performance using NAV and price, with dividend and without dividend and across different time horizon. It is easy for London or ICAP to showcase a chart that favors their argument. Who is more convincing? The answer is simple - look at the AGM results. The shareholders are not stupid and they can vote against the fund manager. BUT, they know ICAP's performance and still vote for Tan Teng Boo. You can say that they are brainwashed, but to do that for 5 years (according to fong7)? The fact is simple, investors themselves are also not comfortable with the macro outlook and not willing to see the fund take on too much exposure. It is so easy to talk with hind-side bias about past performance but when shit happens, it is the investors that suffer, not the keyboard warriors here. Tan Teng Boo's recent performance may not be wonderful, but at least, he is more reliable than many of the "experts" here.