Posted by stockraider > Feb 21, 2016 08:53 PM | Report Abuse

Raider, thanks for your comments. obviously our opinions on margin finance differs by thousands of miles, especially for your statement below.

[RAIDER SAYS ON CONTRARY MARGIN FINANCING SHOULD BE ENCOURAGE TO BE USE BY INVESTOR DURING THEIR YOUNG AGE, IF THEY ARE SUCCESSFUL AND GOOD IN THIS YOUNG AGE OF EXPOSURE AND TRAINING THEY CAN GO REALLY FAR AND SUCCESSFUL LOH....!!]

I do think youngsters can be trained to be good investors to buy stocks with margin of safety (MOS)as you said. That should be able to ensure the success of their investing experience in the long term, safely.

But that won't guarantee the short-term success, simply because the market is unknowable and uncertain, and you could very well be wrong in your assessment.

That is precisely the problem. If youngster invest with margin finance, say 50%:50%, and if the market falls and their stocks lost 60%, their stocks bought with that MOS would have been forced sold long ago and they would have not only lost everything, and even owe the bank more money.

If they have invested in good stocks with high MOS with the money of their own, they can ride it out and the stocks they have bought will eventually rise up in prices.

Even if they are successful the first time, the second time and the third time in using margin finance, it doesn't mean that they will be successful subsequently and all the time. It only requires a couple of times of failure, because of exaggerated losses with margin finance, they can fall and never be able to get up.

Tell me, what do you think of the percentage of failure compared to those who are successful for the general retail investors?

What makes you think that one is more superior in their usage of margin fiance to make out-sized return than others, especially betting against the institutional investors, insiders and syndicates?

Isn't it better to survive happily but lose the opportunity of big gain, rather than fallen down and unable to get up again?

everybody makes mistakes in investing, but they will get up again easily. But with margin finance, few can fall two or three times and get up again. I know of some remisiers and individuals still paying their debts for the losses they have incurred in 1998, 2008 etc. because of the use of margin finance.

[JUST IMAGINE U CAN INVEST AT GETTING FIXED RETURN OF 20% PA WHEN THE FUNDING COST IS ONLY 5% PA....!!]

The above at is also the sales pitch of brokers from investment banks. Seems like there are big fat frogs jumping around.

"When you locate a bargain, you must ask, 'Why me, God? Why am I the only one who could find this bargain?'" - Charlie Munger

Posted by BenBlurBlur > Feb 21, 2016 08:35 PM | Report Abuse
Mr Chong the result if compound rm 100,000 at +15% −10% +25% for 3 consecutive years is not the same as compounding 3 years at average 10% (+15%−10%+25%)÷3 per annum is it? Thank u

Yeah, they are not the same. RM100000 invested with the return given by you will become RM129375 at the end of third year; whereas a compounded annual return (CAR) of the same 10% will become RM133100 as tabulated in the table below.

The gap becomes bigger if the average return is more volatile. Read this:

http://www.investopedia.com/articles/investing/041114/most-accurate-way-gauge-returns-compound-annual-growth-rate.asp


Year 0 1 2 3 Average
average return 15% -10% 25% 10%
Amount 100000 115000 103500 129375
CAR 100000 110000 121000 133100

Posted by ks55 > Feb 21, 2016 12:17 AM | Report Abuse
Big man won't bully small boy.
So kcchongnz should let him free..............


ks55 my friend. No, I don't bully anybody, have I?

He came to my thread which discuss about margin finance, compounding, diversification etc. and trying to insult me.

I just want to discuss and debate with him about issues which he is trying to ridicule me, nothing personal.

I am also entitled to defend myself, don't I?

Posted by paperplane2016 > Feb 21, 2016 12:26 AM | Report Abuse
By the way, I prefer having sex ard yeah! Kekeke. I rather fuck a few knowing who suite me best as wife rather than having wife not fucked prior then regret for whole life then go out to find prostitute to fuk later on or divorce to get another non fuk gf again?? Duh?

Me: It is the same thing.You f anybody I don't give a damn. It is none of my business.

But certainly I won't tell my children to go do this thingy everywhere with condom. At least I tell them what is right and what is wrong. Te same goes with margin financing. I won't tell them to use margin to speculate in the market with care. I will tell them to avoid margin financing. I care about the future of my kids. Don't you?


Posted by paperplane2016 > Feb 21, 2016 12:22 AM | Report Abuse

KC choing NZ, you have kids? U think your kids wanna listen when they at their rebellious yrs? The world had changed, so shld parents. They get tons of info nowadays in YouTube, websites etc. I will not tell my kids he shld not have sex blah blah blah. I will only tell he or she they are responsible efor their own action, and wear condom in having sex. If got pregnant or make ppl pregnant, they have to take full responsibility as action from them.

Same goes with margin. Ppl wanna play margin tephey bear their own responsibility

Posted by paperplane2016 > Feb 21, 2016 12:07 AM | Report Abuse

Why not? KC, understand this way then! I rather my son or daughter don't understand what is sex so they don't get ppl pregnant too early or not pregnant too early???

Or rather you should teach them how to use condom??? Or other methods to tackle issues?

Sooner or later a young generation will be lured to use margin, why no educate them now how it works? I NVR saw kyy asking and promoting it without advising them to understand how margin works. He only giving views where how can one get faster or nearer faster way. Of course with full understanding how it works.



Would you rather tell your daughter not to simply have sex with everyone and everywhere, or never mind lah as long as you know how to use condom?

Is it okay to tell youngsters to f around and it is okay if they know how to use condoms?

Posted by tabularasa > Feb 20, 2016 11:59 PM | Report Abuse
Posted by Icon8888 > Feb 20, 2016 11:46 PM | Report Abuse
It is aggressive to assume 7% yield from fixed income
The credit must be crap
Howard Marks specialises in high yields and have make outsized returns over the years, where people will not normally touch. :-)
2nd level thinking maaa


You are right tabularasa, but bear in mind your fixed income fund managers you mentioned are not Howard Marks. Besides it is not a fixed income like fixed deposit in bank. It is a risky asset, the same as equity.

Posted by paperplane2016 > Feb 20, 2016 11:58 PM | Report Abuse
KC chongnz, billionaire investors cold eye use margin, pls verify your facts. Go study more bursa annual RPT, it is stated there.


Paperplane2016,

Don't you understand what i have said? i don't care if Coldeye uses margin finance or not, because first of all, he doesn't go around and tell everyone he uses it and makes tons of money. Secondly, I don't give a damn if he uses or not. There are many other people I respect use margin finance I believe. It is none of my business.

What I cannot stand is keep on propagating and promoting this thingy to the younger generation, and newbies. It is bad for the society.

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 11:49 PM | Report Abuse
In the long run, everyone is dead.
And stocks for the long run I also find it is a cliches that people use when their recommendations went wrong.
.....lol.


Which "people use when their recommendations went wrong."? What "recommendations"? What went wrong?

Don't you think you just made sweeping statements?

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 11:33 PM | Report Abuse
paperplane2016
2068 posts
Posted by paperplane2016 > Feb 20, 2016 11:25 PM | Report Abuse
It is common for tycoon etc to use margin lah. Even cold rye also use It mah. Surprise this kc so over reacting?
Exactly.......no one has been able to show me a tycoon a businessman who doesn't use borrowings.
Yet....all these idiots here go off on a tangent.


"Borrowing" for what? Aren't we talk about margin finance for buying stocks?

Put it another way, which other "tycoons" use margin finance? Please tell.

Posted by Icon8888 > Feb 20, 2016 11:46 PM | Report Abuse
It is aggressive to assume 7% yield from fixed income
The credit must be crap

It is likely a structured product with the "expected return" of a small component of it, not a promised return from a credit worthy establishment.

tabularasa,

Stock for the long run.

http://www.riosmauricio.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Siegel_Stocks-For-The-Long-Run.pdf

tabularasa,

I said historically the CAGR of equity is about 10%, and that has been true for the past (although it may not, I say may not, be true for the future). How can a fixed income of 7% beats an equity investment giving a CAGR of 10%?

We don't use average return to give a return. That is the gimmicks used by unit trust agent, and also your fixed income fund manager.

The example given by your fixed income manager is probably from a selected 10-year period, a short period, not a 100 year statistics used by academic research. Your selected 10-year period is used to deceive you.

Posted by paperplane2016 > Feb 20, 2016 11:25 PM | Report Abuse
It is common for tycoon etc to use margin lah. Even cold rye also use It mah. Surprise this kc so over reacting?

Don't understand what I am saying?

"I seriously don't give a damn how much money he has made using margin finance. It is none of my business.

But I can't stand people promoting youngsters and newbies to use margin finance. I also feel disgusted when you can come out and sang about it. it is bad for the society. Do you advise your son and daughter to use margin finance?"

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 11:11 PM | Report Abuse
KYY is a business, tycoon. Businessmen and tycoons play by a different rule book.
That is KYY business......he already says he likes to top up whenever his margin account gives him room....looking at the performance of his shares....and they are public knowledge to i3...... I don't understand why it is surprising.
...that brings us to the second point you raised, chong....
why you object to that truism?
business tycoons and business men have different risk tolerance....it is such as obvious statement that they play by a different rule book...what is your objection?

I seriously don't give a damn how much money he has made using margin finance. It is none of my business.

But I can tell you, you know very little about it because you haven't read enough. It is all over in i3investor. Don't just look at the last one year. Look at the last say 3 years.

But I can't stand people promoting youngsters and newbies to use margin finance. I also feel disgusted when you can come out and sang about it. it is bad for the society. Do you advise your son and daughter to use margin finance?

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 10:55 PM | Report Abuse
measuring portfolio performance.............it is such a giant topic, the CFA Institute even got a Diploma just for that. You don't want to go there.
its called the CIPM® Program


Why is it such a giant topic? I have touched on some of them before. Appreciate your input:

http://klse.i3investor.com/blogs/kcchongnz/44334.jsp
http://klse.i3investor.com/blogs/kcchongnz/44336.jsp

But I seriously don't like those stuff in Greeks in my investment.

Posted by tabularasa > Feb 20, 2016 10:52 PM | Report Abuse
Watching 2 respected uncles argue electronically is...*face palm*
Desa has a point, the power of compounding interest diminishes for the equities market, due to its higher volatility, as opposed to fixed income, which one can hold till maturity.
This does not mean Chong's advice of starting to invest young do not apply.
Ceasefire?

Good point tabularasa. I like to discuss issues. Attacking others in persons is bad, more so do not pull in family members to insult. Please stop it.

Tabularasa, market is of course volatile, in the short run. That is why speculate in the market you do in the short term, but investing must be long-term.

Stock market everywhere in the world, I mean matured and emerging markets historically have been giving a compounded annual growth rate of about 10% a year over a long period of time. Aren't we talking about investing?

Investing in the stock market at 10% CAGR becomes RM260000 in ten years, whereas putting in fixed income at 5% yields RM163000, only 70% of equity investment.

If you invest in the equity market for 20 years, it becomes RM673000, compared to RM265000 in fixed income.

So why do you say "the power of compounding interest diminishes for the equities market"?

Posted by Coldrisks > Feb 20, 2016 10:32 PM | Report Abuse
poor Desa, let him go lah, so many attack one, not fair lah.....

I agree the above statement. Please do not get personal.

I wish I can discuss with him about modern portfolio theory, and all CFA matters here. That is why I don't sleep yet.

Posted by Icon8888 > Feb 20, 2016 10:31 PM | Report Abuse
KC it is 330 am now in NZ ? Are u staying up to watch football again ? X P

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 08:26 PM | Report Abuse
Desa: says....Compounding is a lie unless you are talking about fixed income....low rates of fixed income like AAA bonds.

Cool investor: says....Compound interest n modern portfolio theory are 2 different things.

Says practically the same thing.
But I get insulted, not an accountant, don't even know simple accounting, Poh LAN Pa.

Well.......if this is not attacking the messager and not the message, I don't know what is.


Me: Really, what Coolinvestor says and what you say are "practically the same thing"? Does Coolinvestor agrees with you or not?

By the way, the way you praised everything your idol says, including margin calls are good, and put down the opinions of all others, no matter how good their opinions are, is really amazing, you are a very very rare. But that is you. it is ok with me. Everybody is different anyway.

But you come to my thread here which I write about telling youngsters be wary about margin financing, the advantage of compounding, safe and invest, diversification etc., it is ok you praised your idol, as I did admired and praised him last time, but you started insulting me?


Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 19, 2016 05:35 PM | Report Abuse
If I didn't know I could have mistaken you for a unit trust salesman.........lol
KYY is a business, tycoon. Businessmen and tycoons play by a different rule book.

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 04:34 PM | Report Abuse
telling a young man to compound his wealth in the share market is the Biggest lie there ever is.

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 08:26 PM | Report Abuse
Desa: says....Compounding is a lie unless you are talking about fixed income....low rates of fixed income like AAA bonds.

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 07:42 PM | Report Abuse
Jill
All these Internet sifus like Icon and Chong....granted they read a few popular books on investments and have some thing to contribute.
But from there to insult me is another thing.
Talk about stock market and compounding.....got only hazy ideas about beta, alpha and the many many measurements about risks and returns per risk, no idea.
How people measure performance of funds? No idea.

Me: Let us discuss this here. What do you know about beta, alpha and all those Greeks?

How do you measure performance of funds?
Please share.

Posted by kcchongnz > Feb 20, 2016 05:59 PM | Report Abuse X

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 05:55 PM | Report Abuse
Chong
The only thing you know how to do in a debate is insulting.
Address the points I raise. Forget about me.
You know why Index Funds are so popular? They are popular because it is only when it is sufficiently diversified that people can start to talk about compounding.
========================================================
I seriously doubt your knowledge and ability in accounting, even simple accounting.


Me: Talk about insulting. You came to my thread which propagate compounding, diversification, safe and invest for youngsters, but these are what you have written:


Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 19, 2016 05:35 PM | Report Abuse
If I didn't know I could have mistaken you for a unit trust salesman.........lol
KYY is a business, tycoon. Businessmen and tycoons play by a different rule book.

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 04:34 PM | Report Abuse
telling a young man to compound his wealth in the share market is the Biggest lie there ever is.

Huge diversified funds that invests across the world, across all continents and across all asset classes....maybe you have a case to talk about compounding...like the EPF.

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 05:44 PM | Report Abuse
Portfolio Theory.

Icon, Chong...etc and all the millions of gurus and sifus of the stock market.

everyone calls himself a sifu....Have they thoroughly read a book on modern portfolio theory?

Have they even taken a course on Finance or read thoroughly the recommended books by CFA? or even familiarize themselves with the modern thinkers on Portfolio Theory?



What modern portfolio Theory got to do with Diversification?

What do you actually understand of Modern Portfolio Theory?

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 05:55 PM | Report Abuse
Chong
The only thing you know how to do in a debate is insulting.
Address the points I raise. Forget about me.
You know why Index Funds are so popular? They are popular because it is only when it is sufficiently diversified that people can start to talk about compounding.
========================================================
I seriously doubt your knowledge and ability in accounting, even simple accounting.


Talk about insulting.


Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 19, 2016 05:35 PM | Report Abuse
If I didn't know I could have mistaken you for a unit trust salesman.........lol
KYY is a business, tycoon. Businessmen and tycoons play by a different rule book.


Ok, let us get into business.

Why do you mix up diversification with compounding? A new accounting concept?

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 05:31 PM | Report Abuse
Portfolio Theory.

Have they even taken a course on Finance or read thoroughly the recommended books by CFA? or even familiarize themselves with the modern thinkers on Portfolio Theory?

I dare say all these i3 sifus have read some popular books they obtained from their local book stores....but actual Textbooks would be too dull, too boring for them.


Well if you wish, we can debate about modern portfolio theory or any matters relating to CFA here. You an accountant, and me an engineer, a civil engineer.

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 04:47 PM | Report Abuse
of course, I am an accountant. A CPA to be exact.
There are lots common wisdom and a lot of lies.
Telling a young man to compound his wealth in the share market is a conventional wisdom and is also the biggest Lie there is.

=======================================
Tell us frankly, are you really an accountant?
Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 04:51 PM | Report Abuse
There is no compounding unless it is globally diversified, diversified across all asset classes and stay invested at all times and a target return of say 5% pa......then we can talk about compounding.

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 05:38 PM | Report Abuse
let me give you an example. Lets say 30 years compounding.
The end result after 30 years is heavily dependent upon the performance of the first few years. The first few years you go negative, you can forget about the other 30 years.


I seriously doubt your knowledge and ability in accounting, even simple accounting.

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 04:43 PM | Report Abuse
if son needs some some money to do business, give it to him la. Help as much as I can help la.

I don't know about it, looking at this comment below:

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 19, 2016 08:04 PM | Report Abuse
my 23 years old son is spending as fast as he earns and even more.

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 04:34 PM | Report Abuse
telling a young man to compound his wealth in the share market is the Biggest lie there ever is.
Huge diversified funds that invests across the world, across all continents and across all asset classes....maybe you have a case to talk about compounding...like the EPF.
For individuals, please don't even use the word compounding, it just doesn't apply.

Tell us frankly, are you really an accountant?

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 11:53 AM | Report Abuse
My record the last few months.
At the peak up about 20%, now about break even slight up.
I am quite proud.
Of course up 20% is better but life goes on.


I don't know if you come to the right place. This post is about long-term investing and let compound interest has a chance to work out. It is not about making 20% in a month, and then break even another month later.

It is not about looking at the computer screen all the time.

No wonder your statement about compounding won't work.

In long term, we are talking about years, not months, Mr. Compounding is about compounding over a number of years, say 10%-12% over a 20 years period.

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 19, 2016 08:00 PM | Report Abuse
basically I agree with that.
youngsters should not save and invest in other people shares. They may save to invest in themselves or their own business.
I dont even agree to invest in gold, it will be just wasted effort.
invest only when you have spare cash because you cannot spend as fast as you earn.

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 19, 2016 08:04 PM | Report Abuse
my 23 years old son is spending as fast as he earns and even more...but its fine with me as long as his earnings will have exponential growth.


You have very good advice to your son, congrats. Also congrats that you are so sure that your son's "earnings will have exponential growth.

Take your son as an example, how to follow your advice on "invest in their own business" when he "is spending as fast as he earns and even more"?

Isn't it easier if , and only if, he can save a little and invest in a part business without putting in any effort?

As an accountant, an experienced accountant, tell us how many percent of businesses survive?

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 19, 2016 06:45 PM | Report Abuse
Compounded interest is some thing no one can do.
Only other people can do.

Again don't catch what you really mean by a phrase like that. Can elaborate?

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 19, 2016 05:35 PM | Report Abuse
If I didn't know I could have mistaken you for a unit trust salesman.........lol
KYY is a business, tycoon. Businessmen and tycoons play by a different rule book.

Your comments are appreciated. However, instead of short sentences which I catch no balls, can you elaborate a little;

What do you mean that you "could have mistaken you for a unit trust salesman"? And anything wrong with a unit trust salesman?

What do you mean by "a different rule book"?

Posted by goreng_kaki > Feb 20, 2016 03:56 PM | Report Abuse

Kcchong tak bole pakai one la


Goreng kaki,you are spot on.

My investment principles definitely cannot be pakai oleh Goreng kaki.

Posted by buddyinvest > Feb 20, 2016 02:40 PM | Report Abuse

Kcchongnz, it is time to revisit coastal which has been neglected by investing community.

Investing is a popularity contest, and the most dangerous thing is to buy something at the peak of its popularity. The safest and most potentially profitable thing is to buy something when no one likes it, says Howard Mark.


Buddy, I agree with your principle. But i really don't know when oil price will recover. Invest you do but don't swing the fence.

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 19, 2016 05:35 PM | Report Abuse

If I didn't know I could have mistaken you for a unit trust salesman.........lol

KYY is a business, tycoon. Businessmen and tycoons play by a different rule book.

save here first

Posted by SC > Feb 16, 2016 11:26 AM | Report Abuse

we are investing on the future business/incomes of VS and Hon Hai.
hon hai is too big to grow bigger but vs has plenty of room to grow bigger.
we should use the FIV (future intrinsic value) and not past/current intrinsic value if we are investing for future gain.


I didn't know there is such thing as past/current and future intrinsic value of stock.

The intrinsic value of a stock is the the discounted value of all its future cash flows to the investors.

handsomejong TOTAL DIVIDEND LAST YEAR=14.4C, LAST PRICE=1.19

0.144/1.19=12.1%

CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG


Yes, you are wrong.Those dividends were given for the last year before the split. Hence you need to divide by 5.

Posted by Lee Yih Yeong > Feb 15, 2016 06:39 PM | Report Abuse
the ROIC is damn high 13.4%, which is good for company future.

You are not wrong. ROIC is not bad.

Posted by handsomejong > Feb 15, 2016 06:36 PM | Report Abuse
OK WAITING FOR YOUR CORRECT FIGURE

Posted by handsomejong > Feb 15, 2016 06:25 PM | Report Abuse
IT'S 12.1% TO BE EXACT. SO IT'S NOT THAT BAD AFTER ALL.

I think you probably use the pre-split price as the base of your computation.

Posted by handsomejong > Feb 15, 2016 06:25 PM | Report Abuse
IT'S 12.1% TO BE EXACT. SO IT'S NOT THAT BAD AFTER ALL.

Your number is most likely wrong too.

Posted by handsomejong > Feb 15, 2016 05:49 PM | Report Abuse
JUST NOT SURE HOW U COME OUT WITH DY OF 1.2%. ARE U SURE?

I think I got it from a public website. But the dividend of 1.5 sen is for the interim dividend 2016. So the DY stated as 1.2% which should be based on the whole year is not right. It should be higher.

Thanks for pointing out.

Posted by enning22 > Feb 15, 2016 12:03 PM | Report Abuse
how silly, one keeps raising doubt about Vs ,from a year back , while investors witnessing price picking up from 2.00 at (1$ par value)to 8.00,then split into 20sen par value) , now corrected down to 1.20 , equacalent 6.00 (,20sen x5), it is time to reconsider somebody valuation method which obviously contain much flaws.


It will be more fruitful for discussions here if you can identify the "flaws" in these valuation techniques and deliberate your thoughts here, rather than just just say they "contain much flaws" without any basis.

I will be very happy to hear from you.

Be aware that in stock market, price isn't equate to value.

Good sharing from a true Master trader.

Posted by engeng > Feb 14, 2016 03:23 PM | Report Abuse
KC, heard tat u gv online FA training, can gv some info about that?

Please contact me at

ckc14training2@gmail.com

Teck Chuan,

Coastal used to be in huge net cash position with minimal borrowings and hence low risk, and they were doing very well in their operating business in ship building. The latest report has shown it went into a net borrowing position. But I agree it is still not that bad in terms of total debt in relation to its total equity.

When it get into more exposure in the oil and gas sector, the plunge of oil price has affected all companies in this industry.

That caused the huge drop in the share price of those companies, including Coastal. That is just a reflection of the state of the O&G companies now.

Now,I don't predict the price of oil in the future, and the prospect of O&G companies. One thing I can say is in business, almost everything is cyclic. That implies oil price will definitely rise again, but I don't know when.

Posted by TeckChuan Lee > Feb 11, 2016 11:39 PM | Report Abuse

"It was the alert of a course participant which prevented me from average down when the share price continued to drop, and instead I cut loss at an early stage, though I still own a little now."

What was the trouble you found with coastal that made you sell most of your position?


The heavy exposure on 2 jack-up rigs with heavy borrowings and the crash of oil price.

新年快乐 to you too, icon8888

Posted by Ntpboon > Feb 11, 2016 02:56 PM | Report Abuse
KC, 新年快乐！
谢谢分享！
这十“不”将成为我的座右铭。
这也是游览 i3 股市新手的新年礼物。
若能领悟，必有所获。

Posted by regnig > Feb 11, 2016 02:14 PM | Report Abuse

i truly respect your experience and wisdom sharing mr.chong! gong hei fatt choy!



奇連伊士活 说, "「你令我很開心！」

「You make my day!」Clint Eastwood

Posted by chhngtan > Feb 11, 2016 11:00 AM | Report Abuse

Thanks KC. You did a great job. I feel all your articles are very helpful. Keep it up. Wishing you to have a prosperous year and be healthy. Gong Xi Fa Chai.


Posted by Jester > Feb 11, 2016 11:03 AM | Report Abuse
Great article again KC. Happy CNY. Gong Xi Fa Chai!
I feel like during this difficult times, your stocks will be perform better than average people out there.


Thank you very much. These make my day. Whether my stocks will perform better doesn't matter, yet to know. But sharing (of knowledge, whether you agree or not) to me is better.

Posted by Mat Cendana > Feb 10, 2016 11:26 AM | Report Abuse

#1 OPM - I agree with the general precaution here, about investors/speculators often not taking into full consideration the impact towards their account and capital when things move the other way. At the moment, I'm not using margin. But I feel it should also be considered as an option to be utilised on certain occasions. Despite the risks.

It's a bit like a credit card too - it's not the CC or margin that's the main problem, but the person using it. To me, it's always better when we have more choices. Having a CC or margin shouldn't mean we are using it all the time. When used properly, it can be a very useful tool. The more important thing to consider is in having a proper plan, including prudent capital management and the discipline to execute cut loss at a predetermined point. And also to take profit when the indicators say that the better thing to do.


Mat Cendana,thanks for your comments. I always appreciate it. But I don't agree with you in this case that margin financing is like a credit card.

Credit card is a very useful thing for me for many reasons. Without it, it will be very inconvenient for me. It is a very useful tool for me. The most it costs me is its annual fee, RM50?

To set up a margin finance account for you to use if you need it involves substantial cost, 1%? You will be out of pocket of RM10000 upfront to set up a RM1m margin finance facility. Not sure if there is any maintenance fee.

Won't you use it after paying the upfront RM10000? If not, why would you set it up in the first place? Just for fun and pay the upfront fee?

That is what exactly this Mr Lee did in the link here:

http://klse.i3investor.com/blogs/kcchongnz/61822.jsp

Mind you this is not a made-up story, but a true story. And Mr Lee is not a novice speculator, but a very experience investor who had used margin financing for all his investing life and would have used this facility "properly". Look how he controlled his margin finance in this account, and how has his this account fared?

Would you still be able to stand up with the performance of his this account?

Posted by goreng_kaki > Feb 10, 2016 09:36 PM | Report Abuse
Skp have a PE ratio of 26......i think you should write more about skp not vs.....

I don't know about every stock in Bursa. But I do know a little about V.S as a retail investor, and I find this stock very interesting,and hence I write quite a bit about it to share with people like you. I notice many who hold this stock, and still holding, and those contemplating buying this stock, do have interest reading about what I have written about V.S.

Sharing is caring mah. Of course I don't force you to read if you don't wish to.

So far, what is the problem you have about me writing about this stock? Have I got facts and figures wrongly presented? Have I twisted any fact? Please let me know and I will correct them, asap.

Posted by globalvalueinvestor > Feb 9, 2016 11:04 AM | Report Abuse
but the profitable margin is consistently downtrend, that is the issue. Until the next time usd weak, only can consider.

Margin is contracting, no doubt about it. However, the company sells more stuff. The lower margin is compensated by higher asset turnover to maintain a high return on equity.

Please read this:

http://klse.i3investor.com/blogs/kcchongnz/90970.jsp