iFag, if can afford, of course CA and CD. If looking for value, then can buy CE, CF. CG is good but liquidity is a problem as it is thinly traded.

CH, which was highlighted by me, has gone up too high.

Try to download KLSE screener apps, it is a very, very useful apps !!! It calculates the premium and ratio of the call warrants.

Thomas, Tech stocks are still hot - Inari, Penta, VS, Vitrox. Penta has insider selling shares, so not so good. You can consider Vitrox CD at around 25 cents.

Try to look at Leon and Masteel, Choo Bee cos steel sector should be OK also.

Today, took some profit, but still holding some shares. Will be buying when HRC undergoes consolidation.

Thomas, buy Vitrox call warrant, cheap.

Also, steel stocks , especially LeonFB, and Masteel.

Gamuda C 39 is also extremely cheap. I bought at much higher price.

Happy, we beat Petron, ha ha ha.!!! Heard HRC may consider granting people and Analyst for briefing. After IB write up, guess ?

If that happens, guess 18 rgt can be reached early !! I think value wise, CE, CF better as lower ratio.

Fat CNY AngPow !! Siapa boleh kasi right !!

Still not to late to go to HRC call warrant. Conservative eps 4 th qtr for HRC is RM 1.20, so total yr eps is RM 3.60

At PE 5x, value should be RM 18.

Asked traders buy CH, now jumped lots. Time to go for HRC CE, and CF which is fairly valued for its long maturity, after HRC results known by end February.

Anyway, have also bought some PetronM shares.

Thomas Han, did you buy the call warrant ?

Alamak, told some HRC CH undervalued. Now, vroom like rocket !! Sayang, sold too early!!

Now Ch overvalued. Time for CE, and Cf to move. Wanna Join ?

Thks Sifu OTB, KYY !! not forgetting Stock raider for his confidence !!

Target RM 15.50 can be reached by 31/12!!

BY CNY, can reach TP 21 ?

KYY wrote that when all IBs are bullish on certain stocks, maybe time to sell.

So now, there has yet to be a reco by IBs, then it is time to be contrarian and buy1

Richman 96, e mail to Mr Ooi Teik Bee at tbooifx@gmail.com. remember, you also have to do FA and TA before you decide.

sometimes, he also makes mistakes as he has no insider info. But he is good. Asked us to buy Heng Yuan below RM 7, but most hesistated as we think price is already high.

If using 3rd quarter results, then full year eps is RM3.60 !! Believe this is v.conservative estimate.

Already close to end Dec, Oct and NOv , and probably Dec margin spread average USD9+.

Brent Crude, more than USD 60 !! Inventory gain.

Ringgit appreciate, relative to USD, so forex gain.

I think re rating will occur as earnings clearly visible, stable and consistent high profit, and IB takes notice. Fair PE say 7x. Focus and Edge magazines published write up.

Thus, maybe TP of 21 is conservative and have to increase to RM 25 !!

A good Christmas gift and CNY Ang Pow for those who believe and act on it !!

As Hoolahoo mentioned, Heng Yuan is very undervalued, and switching to HRC made me to recover my losses.

Target of 15 rgt is very conservative. Many have Target of 21 rgt !!

Read comments on HRC and you will know the reasons for their optimism .

Mind sharing the basis of your statement that it is undervalued. Thanks.

So far, only Heng Yuan has planned for upgrading to Euro 4M. Petron has yet to do so.

BY the way, many forumers has target of RM21. Can I know the basis of the calculation, is it based on EPS, and PE same as present PetronM ?

At the time Shell sold to HRC, crack margin was almost negative and losing money.

Now it is opposite, and refiners will be making billions of money !! If HRC turns in 1 rgt eps for 4 th quarter, then total year profit, exceeds 1 billion !!! Up to 3 rd quarter already RM2.40 eps.!!

300m paid up share capital of 1 rgt, x eps of 3.40 rgt. Target very, very conservative = RM15.

yes, C31 is cheaper, lower premium and higher volume.

C34 has advantage of longer expiry date, though more expensive by 3x. Premium almost comparable.

People buy CW for their gearing effect, small outlay of capital , and a chance to gain profit, which without CW, you dont have ability to participate.

When HRC ordinary shares go up, in most cases, the CW price will normally go up, UNLESS some force, try to stifle the advance so that they can buy more before price go up !!! Just like accumulation of shares b4 they push price up.

Go to Malaysia warrants com my by Macquire to understand more.

Hai yah, susah susah, just close your eyes lah, buy or trade on paper to understand more OK. You have to pay for your lessons !! I lost a lot on YTL call warrant C8, buying 6 figure amount at 9 cents, but HRC helped me to recover. Be assured , good that not many believe in HRC, otherwise you cant get CW, at such LOW premium !!

Over and out.

Figures too small, and no explanation on charts.

Now only CH starts to move !! Thomashan, you have to do your homework !!! The longer time period, higher the premium cos time has VALUE !!

It is not necesary for premium to increase always. If HRC price increase, but CH does not move, then premium will go down !!

With call warrant, you must always be careful of Market Maker, or the Investment Bank. they sat the pace. there are times you want to sell, at 4.45 pm, , suddenly no buyer at all !!

Then you want to buy, but there are no sellers, so liquidity is important. When call warrants or company warrant close to maturity, tendency for the price to be driven down.

First criteria in buying CW is the lower the premium better. BUT be careful of expiry as trading close 1 wk before expiry. If you hold until expiry, you frust, cos money will be held up for around 3 weeks as I have experienced it many times.

In conclusion, if you have huge capital, buy Mother share. If moderate capital, buy CA or CD as conversion ratio is less than 10:1

However, me, I dont have lots of capital, so I go for cheaper CW, but one with reasonable premium and got time b4 expiry;

Many plus points for HRC. Target of 13, then 15 rgt, is v possible to reach. Margin spread is ave USDollar 9, Ringgit go up, Brent Crude higher than 60 US, high Inventory gain, which if they want can already wipe off all the debts !!!

So, as they say, Apa lagi you takut to go in ? Today Focus has write up on HRC, and CIMB overweight on O and Gas. Barring, fire ( touch wood ), unforeseen maintenance work, derivative loss, USD go up, EPS for last quarter is v conservative , RM1. Total 3.40 rgt for year.

13 and 15 rgt, IMO, HRC boleh !!!

should also consider Heng Yuan.

Heng Yuan still a buy as expected eps for year, v conservative is RM 3.40. Average crack margin at USD 9+, more than last quarter of US 8. At US 8, eps was RM1.20. At US 9 crack margin, eps should be more barring unexpected shut down or maintenance work.

Those with low capital, can try call warrant CH, cheap at around 3 % premium for a long duration till end June 2018. BY then HRC may already touch more than 15 rgt. Premium among lowest, besides CA, and CD.

Other CW follow Mom, go higher. Only CH is below level on December 4 where CH touch 45, 46 cents and is now only 41 cents. !!

Opportunity, when it comes, please grab it before you miss it.

On 4/12, HRC was at RM 11.40 and call warrant CH was at around 45 cents. Now HRC at 12.50 rgt, , but call warrant CH is at ---42 cents!!

So CH still has potential to go up as it is only 3% premium to Mother, for those with low capital.

HRC earnings visibility is v good, and is a complex refiner. Present crack margin is still around 10, compared to latest report average of 8. Brent crude is still over US 50.

At 8 margin, eps is RM 1.20 for 3 rd quarter, so at margin of 10, eps for 4 th quarter is ???

At the present rate, HRC can possibly touch RM 13 before year end.

Forgot to tell you all, so far NO Investment Bank has covered HRC. Just imagine if an IB gives a recommendation to buy HRC, because - very, very low PE, high Cash Flow, highest ROE,high transparency, simple to understand profitability etc.

I believe IB have not collected enough to cover for their call warrant exposure and they are scrambling. Once they have their CW covered, then only will they issue a recommendation to buy.

Worth a try for those brave enough. Price can only go higher from here.

It depends, 100 shares of HRC costs RM1,246. For RM1246, you can buy 3 HRC CD call warrants, each costing RM400, with a gearing of over 2. Risk of Call warrant is higher compared to buying HRC ordinary share.

However, in uptrend, call warrant performance is profitable. 40 cents x 12 =4.80 add 8 rgt Ex Px, gives 12.80, total value, minus present Mom's price of 12.46, Thus premium you pay because you have a chance to participate in Heng Yuan despite price of 12.46, by paying only 40 cents, and valid for long months, is 34 cents divided by Mom 12.46, giving you a premium of over 2% !!!

For me, it is a small price to pay, to give those daring enough to offer an apportunity to get profit.every time HRC go up in price, due to lack of capital !!

Already going to be end of December, and Crack Margin is high, thus barring unforeseen circumstances, a very conservative eps estimate of more than RM1/ for 4 th quarter is very highly achievable.!! Plus HRC has no tax.!!

For those new to call warrant, premium is amount in percentage, the higher price you pay compared to fair value when you convert to Mother share, i.e.- price you pay, times the conversion ratio, then add the exercise price.

CH has the advantage of being a low price, 40 cents, and the premium is low, comparable to CD which is higher price at around 71 cents.

Cheap entry to Heng Yuan if you believe it can go higher,( Rm 15/ possible plus higher percentage gain !!! - Bought many, and will be buying more, i.e. if the price, still never move !!!

Fred Tam says 12.30 resistance, now higher already. All time high, so no more resistance ?

Call warrant CH is a screaming buy as the premium is v low as it hardly moved the past few days tho Mom moved a lot !!!

HRC can definitely be higher than Petron as all parameters are better than Petron, i.e., PE, ROE, FCF ,etc except dividend which they need money for upgrading.

Target of RM 15, definitely highly possible.!!!!

HRC priority is to perform well, no fire, increase mgt efficiency !!!

Then profit increase, cash flow more, share price will go up. Loans can be easily paid when they sell inventories which they stock up to cover during maintenance period.

4 th quarter, HRC confident making conservative eps of 1 rgt. due to good crack spread for Oct, NOv already.

OTB and KYY are men of integrity and they dont do this. KYY recommends that we dont sell HRC as the potential gain is large.

HRC will go up in price further should they declare a simple dividend or share split and when people realize how undervalued this share is. It is a screaming buy. Not many can buy as price is high, but they can buy call warrant, the best is CA, second - CD.

Anyhow, this price wont stay for long as its fundamentals are too strong to ignore. - Do read Part 7. Price is facing roadblock at 11.30 rgt, so that institutional buyers can still buy at low price. I believe when they have gathered enough, then it will be recommended to the public.

Strange isn't it, up till now no coverage on HRC, only Petron.

When IB comes out with favorable report on HRC, then you will see the price jumps.

Buying more as, compared to Petron, Pet Dagang, more superior in every aspect, ROE, PE, FCF, etc.

Call warrant CD is better than CC as premium lower and also to others - except CA, which has the lowest premium.

Dr David LIm has done thorough analysis of HRC, and surmised that it can possibly earn more than 300 million. Year EPS, more than RM3. At present price 11.28, price ridiculously low !!! Highest Eps in Bursa. Where can find another ?

If they can push Petron, dont see why cannot push up HRC which is seriously very undervalued !!!

Not to worry, see how Petron rebound after same article ask to sell !!

Today
T plus 3, sontra players sell mah. Later, can go up.

Good if can buy more, sure untung.

Surprised that many call warrant buyers, buy call warrants based on price, volume traded, rather than based on lower premium.

CB, CC higher premium than CD, yet their price is higher.

I believe more value for your money by buying CD, premium only around 3 %, if not wrong.

HY price can go higher as estimated eps for year is around 3.60, highest in Bursa.the ROE is very high, and at very conservative pe 5, price should be RM 18. KYY advise not to sell, but buy at this level.

In valuing call warrants, the lower the premium the better as we have to take into consideration the exercise price and the conversion ratio.

Dont base decision on price alone !!

If I am not mistaken, the call warrant with least premium is HRC- CD at around 5 %, maturing end February 2018.

Someone said, the investment bankers will scramble to cover their call warrant exposure when HRC price rises. There are many call warrants on HRC, so price can and will go up.

Also if there is a write up on HRC by investment bank like Kenanga, Public Invest, etc as shown recently on PetronM, with higher Target Price, due to expected higher eps, then price can possibly go up.

However, contra players will square off on or before T + 3, so price may jump after that. Tomorrow will be an exciting day for HRC believers. !!

If 4 th qtr eps is around 1.20 rgt, total year eps is 3.60 rgt. Assuming very conservative PE of 5, then HRC should touch RM 18.

Crack spread is higher in 4 th qtr, and assuming no derivative loss as ringgit strengthens, no shutdown, some inventory gain as OPEC maintain production cut, plus no taxation.

This, is quite achievable.

This company, ROE incredibly high !!! Up to 3 rd qtr, already more than 40% !!

If Investment bank do write up, price will be higher !!!! Can touch RM 15, if pe 5x , and total for year eps 3 rgt. Crack spread, forex improving !!!

Special thanks to David LIm, confidence of OTB, KYY, and others. Incredible results!! If eps for year, around 3 rgt, few in bursa can match result, right ?

For whole year, eps, more than RM 3!!!

Broke 3 rd qtr jinx !!!! Hurrah !!!

Petron philipines recorded higher sales and turnover for Malaysia. Thus profit should be more. Heng Yuan wih higher production and high margin should show profit maybe of Rm 1 / eps for 3 rd quarter. Notice that Investment House has not issued a buy call yet. !!!

Some Funds suspected selling P Dagang and moving to better fundamentals company i.e. Heng Yuan, if this happens , re rating will occur !!

call warrant buyers, please know premium you are paying. Those priced lower, the premium generally very much higher as conversion ratio is higher, sometimes 20:1 as compared to 10:1.

well written article, Hopefully price will go up.

Mom share drop as it is x, icps. Price will be adjusted after 5 cents div, so 79 - 5, = 74 cents. So no point to change to Mom for LA and icps as lower than, should you exercise, cost price of 87 and 80 cents !!

CPS, convertible Preference share is better than LA which bears no interest at all. Difficult to say which is better, Buy Mom to get icps, at 90 cents now, then pay for 8 icps, costing 640 rgt. Then sell Mom after dividend to get back capital. Your cost is 900 less 50, or RM850. After xd, sell Mom, so use this 850 to pay for 8 icps at 8 cents for Rm640. Pening sikit !!

considering worth to convert LA to Mom , or buy Mom. After the issuance of icps, mother share adjusted ? need 10 icps to convert to Mom, or one icps + 72 cents. Since icps ex px lower than LA, 80 sen, compared to 87sen, icps value more than LA. Yes, many bought LA at higher than 30 sen, and did not change to MOm as you require 90 cents, but gets div of 10 cents.

if year eps is around 24 cents, then Masteel worth to invest as PE less than 10,

still prefer loan stock. lower conversion price of 90 sen, compared to warrant of RM 1.00 !!

Excellent sharing. Dont know why price fall when results out, but still a good share for investment by PE, ROE, FCF standard.

CC still has 1 month to go , and now at Zero premium!! Worse to worse at maturity, you will get your money back if price is at this level. No doubt lose a bit if cost is 25 cents.

When Heng Yuan result out,very soon, possible for PetronM to go up. Should CC player still want to play, maybe switch to Heng Yuan CE, longer maturity and premium less than PetronM CD.!!

Prefer CF, as less capital involved and premium difference for CE, not that much.

Prefer CF !! CE is higher price compared to CF, normally when premium not much difference, better to buy cheaper, less capital. For CG, the premium is higher than CF.

So, CF is better value buy. People buy call warrant based on premium, lesser the better, if expiry dates almost same.

CC uses less capital, and banker will pay you your profit at maturity, which is still more than 1 month. bird in hand worth two in the bush ?