Posted by moneySIFU > 2016-09-21 14:19 | Report Abuse

Rubbish Icapital, at time of crisis, keep calling shareholders to convince vote for TTB, courier the proxy form followed up by callS, ask to fax back so can retain TTB as fund manager.

All funds including oversea which managed by TTB are all extremely poorly performed.

Posted by MG9231 > 2016-09-21 14:48 | Report Abuse

The Highest historical price of Icap Bhd is $2.70 on 9-1-2008. Current NAV is $3.13 and cash in and is about 71% of $3.13. If it is liquidated in next 6 months. Assuming cost of disposal of investment in hand and liquidation expenses is $0.05.
Each shareholders should be able to get back $3.08 ($3.13-$$0.05) which is higher than the historical price. I think no investors in Icap Bhd will make any losses. In view of current icap price stay at $2.37. There are those unfortunate one who invested at its peak will also be able to recoup their loss. So All Shareholders, should I suggest liquidate this icap bhd before more damaging is done by its untouchable, arrogant, immoral , despicable, exploitative and obsolete Fund Manager Tan Teng Boo who appears to be incompetent in last 6 years.

Posted by kcchongnz > 2016-09-21 15:49 | Report Abuse

Posted by MG9231 > Sep 21, 2016 02:48 PM | Report Abuse
So All Shareholders, should I suggest liquidate this icap bhd?


That would definitely be the best interest of all icap shareholders in my opinion.

Posted by ckkhen > 2016-09-21 16:21 | Report Abuse

If I am not mistaken, liquidation is only after fund is listed for 15 years i.e. in 2020! So, how?

Posted by MG9231 > 2016-09-21 16:35 | Report Abuse

According to Agenda 5 of upcaoming AGM on 24-9-16, Amendment will be made to suggest a review and a resolution of liquidation of Icap Bhd by its directors can only be done in year 2025.
Mainwhile, the only option available to achieve winding up of Icap Bhd before year 2025 is to get all shareholders who disagree with the ways of operation of Icap bhd by current management to get together and call a EGM suggesting icap Bhd be liquidated and get it approve.

Posted by Benjamin_8888 > 2016-09-21 16:43 | Report Abuse

good luck!

Posted by kcchongnz > 2016-09-21 16:44 | Report Abuse

Posted by MG9231 > Sep 21, 2016 04:35 PM | Report Abuse
According to Agenda 5 of upcaoming AGM on 24-9-16, Amendment will be made to suggest a review and a resolution of liquidation of Icap Bhd by its directors can only be done in year 2025.


Any shareholders vote for this is a stupid fool.

Posted by MG9231 > 2016-09-21 16:46 | Report Abuse

So, all shareholders who bought higher than current market price of $2.37 must find ways to cooperate with City of London Fund manager to wrist the control from current management of Icap Bhd. Of course, with agree in principle to liquidate Icap Bhd subsequently.

Posted by makubex718 > 2016-09-21 16:49 | Report Abuse

His explanation will be he is long term investor will only looking for opportunity for fundamental good shares and sell at 50% discount.

if follow his magazine totally no shares can buy

Posted by LLHu > 2016-09-21 16:52 | Report Abuse

Some may post this into Capital Dynamic's facebook and see how TTB responds

Posted by LLHu > 2016-09-21 16:54 | Report Abuse

https://www.facebook.com/capitaldynamics.icapital/

Posted by MG9231 > 2016-09-21 16:55 | Report Abuse

I think with costless telephone technology such as WhatsApp, or blogspots or even i3 investors plateform, those disagree with Tan Teng Boo, can easily connect with each other and hope to get together for such purpose. Then joint up with City of London who are already fed upor lookded down by Tan Teng Boo .

Posted by makubex718 > 2016-09-21 16:59 | Report Abuse

Go his event this sat and ask free entrance geh...but i think lot people ask ad gua...

He got his point the cash he has very big and since he is so careful he wont take the risk or any risk to do investment. He will just sit and wait market crash and buy

Posted by MG9231 > 2016-09-21 17:27 | Report Abuse

Posted by kcchongnz > Sep 21, 2016 04:44 PM | Report Abuse

Posted by MG9231 > Sep 21, 2016 04:35 PM | Report Abuse
According to Agenda 5 of upcaoming AGM on 24-9-16, Amendment will be made to suggest a review and a resolution of liquidation of Icap Bhd by its directors can only be done in year 2025.


Any shareholders vote for this is a stupid fool.


KcChong, you are perfectly correct.

By 2025, if Icap Bhd still underperformed as like now, he is continuing his way of bluffing by bullshitting world economy problems and is sleeping on his job, can't generate cash from investment , let say fees pay to Tan Teng Boo average 7 millions a year, with 9 years to go, it will be (7m * 9) = $65M already "sapu" or "rompak" by Tan Teng Boo as management and advisory fees. How much will it left to current shareholders?

Posted by MG9231 > 2016-09-21 17:42 | Report Abuse

So, Judge yourselves, are you going to safeguard your money or let Tan Teng Boo continue to rob you through management and advisory fees.

Posted by MuttonCurry > 2016-09-21 17:46 | Report Abuse

TTB old man oledi .. Find lah one sexy young thing as CEO ... maybe then ICAP can move.... same old tired faces like our moronic politicians ... how to move without fresh face ?

Posted by kcchongnz > 2016-09-21 18:56 | Report Abuse

Posted by MG9231 > Sep 21, 2016 05:27 PM | Report Abuse
By 2025, if Icap Bhd still underperformed as like now, he is continuing his way of bluffing by bullshitting world economy problems and is sleeping on his job, can't generate cash from investment , let say fees pay to Tan Teng Boo average 7 millions a year, with 9 years to go, it will be (7m * 9) = $65M already "sapu" or "rompak" by Tan Teng Boo as management and advisory fees. How much will it left to current shareholders?


That is exactly the reason why icap is undervalued by about 24% now.

Posted by MG9231 > 2016-09-21 19:16 | Report Abuse

kcchongnz Posted by MG9231 > Sep 21, 2016 05:27 PM | Report Abuse
By 2025, if Icap Bhd still underperformed as like now, he is continuing his way of bluffing by bullshitting world economy problems and is sleeping on his job, can't generate cash from investment , let say fees pay to Tan Teng Boo average 7 millions a year, with 9 years to go, it will be (7m * 9) = $65M already "sapu" or "rompak" by Tan Teng Boo as management and advisory fees. How much will it left to current shareholders?


That is exactly the reason why icap is undervalued by about 24% now.


No,i don't think so, i think is fully valued
let us assuming $65m is budgeted for his next 9 years management and advisory fees with no cash inflow from investment as he is timing for the bear. Please note that cash will not be generated immediately after investment. it takes time to harvest..
$65m divided by 140,000,000 shares = $0.46 .
so, Current RAV of $3.13 -$0.46 will be $2.67
current market price $2.37
$2.67-$2.37 = $0.30 or $2.67/$2.37 =12.6%
so, do you think it is undervalued ?

Posted by calvintaneng > 2016-09-21 19:30 | Report Abuse

Posted by MG9231 > Sep 21, 2016 07:16 PM | Report Abuse

kcchongnz Posted by MG9231 > Sep 21, 2016 05:27 PM | Report Abuse
By 2025, if Icap Bhd still underperformed as like now, he is continuing his way of bluffing by bullshitting world economy problems and is sleeping on his job, can't generate cash from investment , let say fees pay to Tan Teng Boo average 7 millions a year, with 9 years to go, it will be (7m * 9) = $65M already "sapu" or "rompak" by Tan Teng Boo as management and advisory fees. How much will it left to current shareholders?


That is exactly the reason why icap is undervalued by about 24% now.


No,i don't think so, i think is fully valued
let us assuming $65m is budgeted for his next 9 years management and advisory fees with no cash inflow from investment as he is timing for the bear. Please note that cash will not be generated immediately after investment. it takes time to harvest..
$65m divided by 140,000,000 shares = $0.46 .
so, Current RAV of $3.13 -$0.46 will be $2.67
current market price $2.37
$2.67-$2.37 = $0.30 or $2.67/$2.37 =12.6%
so, do you think it is undervalued ?

Hahaha!

MG9231 the Great Accountant can really count. TTB cannot bluff anymore.

If things remain status quo the risk and reward in ICap Biz only favors TTB himself.

And TTB's Capital Dynamics only has 689,000 ICapbiz shares which he bought since umpteen years ago. Only worth about Rm1.6 millions plus.

He used this as a decoy to lure zombie investors into Icapbiz while sucking Rm6 million fees yearly.

Why don't KcChongnz & MG9231 pair up and start another fund. Sure will beat ICapbiz hands down!

Posted by MG9231 > 2016-09-21 19:34 | Report Abuse

That is the reason why i said he is drawing a big biscuit on the wall, you can see it but cannot grab it.
He will neither willing to proposed co share buy back because he reserve all the cash for his personal management and advisory fees.
he can ask for amendment for Memorandum and Article of the company favourable to himself but not amend for benefit of shareholders such as distribution of dividend.
That is the reasons why i call him immoral, unethical , unprofessional, exploitative and sucking fund manager.

Posted by ckkhen > 2016-09-21 21:51 | Report Abuse

Regarding dividend, TTB says no problem as long as majority of shareholders want it. But so far no takers.
City of London (15.7%) is the only active one. The other 14% US Fund managers keep quiet only. So do most Malaysian shareholders.

If nothing positive comes out in the AGM which I am attending, I'll sell out gradually, after all my average price is 1.81. Better take care of myself first. I advise others to cut loss if need be.

Posted by nhy6 > 2016-09-22 10:26 | Report Abuse

u hold so many shares u dont make money. u r so stress u hav to do so much work. simple advice sell your shares n have a happy life!!!!

Posted by i4investor > 2016-09-22 10:34 | Report Abuse

if I not mistaken, he want to wait for crisis only buy, so he said cash is king, but he already no aware, or already stay in comfort zone, resistance to change. A quality fund managers can make return, ROI in good time & bad time. If need to wait long long, wait crisis, then, unless we can live 100 years above ++, if not...is opportunity loss

Posted by Jonathan Keung > 2016-09-22 10:38 | Report Abuse

TTB is an experienced guy ( but to wait for a crisis ) before putting the cash to work is something i disagreed. As a fund manager. your job is to grow the funds size and price.

BY holding on to cash and waiting for the right time to invest is counter productive, WE have seen the subprime, PIGGS debt, Greece default and the Brexit. Not forgeting the Lehman bros etc this is my personal view on Icap

Posted by ardourboy > 2016-09-22 11:45 | Report Abuse

Posted by nhy6 > Sep 22, 2016 10:26 AM | Report Abuse

u hold so many shares u dont make money. u r so stress u hav to do so much work. simple advice sell your shares n have a happy life!!!


I believe that guy is not stress at all, and the work from the post above looks very simple and clear cut, doesnt really take much work and already reflect the weakness in TTB managing ICAP.

What you are saying is just similarly like Malaysian Politician that tell other races to go back their own country when they are not happy with their government. Does the people (shareholder) not able to question the government (management) in their performance?

Somehow i feel u are more stress, people comment more on the ICAP weakness the more u want to argue, are u scared of ICAP share price dropping more? You might make more right now if the shareholder are able to dissolve the fund and get back their money right now.

Posted by Cipta > 2016-09-22 12:18 | Report Abuse

Do not listen to the voice to ask you sell instead of question the management if you have the option. Why someone ask you to sell at cheap instead you can fire the management and bring back your money at RM3? I believe if COL successfully appoint a director into the board and do something like re-appoint new fund manager, setup new KPI for TTB, share buy back etc , the share price will start moving up.

Posted by paperplane2016 > 2016-09-22 12:48 | Report Abuse

wahaha! laugh die me. Openly said TTB not competence. wow, look bad on him

Posted by paperplane2016 > 2016-09-22 12:49 | Report Abuse

liquidate also nothing much ,25% extra only

Posted by i4investor > 2016-09-22 12:51 | Report Abuse

ya, so much cash, they can share buy back to push up it, or he waiting ICAP also crash or in crisis...as he aware he no more golden finger?

Posted by ICAPSHITT > 2016-09-22 13:10 | Report Abuse

i suggest icap investors try to liase with City of London, contact them to work together to kick ttb out. as a collective, the support against the arrogant, staff abusing fund manager that is ttb, will work. not too late. agm this saturday

Posted by MG9231 > 2016-09-22 13:22 | Report Abuse

Posted by nhy6 > Sep 22, 2016 10:26 AM | Report Abuse

u hold so many shares u dont make money. u r so stress u hav to do so much work. simple advice sell your shares n have a happy life!!!!


Hello,Tan Teng Boo, early morning already come to peep at this forum to see people talk bad about you. It shows you are more stress than me. I just came back from lunch with friends but you are already there to peep our discussions, sorry hor not able to entertain you on time. Never mind lah, i think you will drop by to peep at this forum soon. For your information, As a investor, life is rather boring, so must kay poh chi fund manager abit. to make fun lah especially Icap Bhd AGM is around the corner , talk bad about you with fingers on keyboards so that more icap investors will "taruk" you during AGM. make hard time for you . sooo Happy and I enjoy it

Posted by Jonathan Keung > 2016-09-22 14:29 | Report Abuse

the last Agm (Icap ) everybody voted for TTB. Just wait and see this round any firefight

Posted by stonebridge > 2016-09-22 14:36 | Report Abuse

As a professional fund manager, even crisis also can make money do not talk about "cash is king" such a crappy statement.

The fund already lose the opportunity to make shareholders' money to work for shareholders! Why people want to invest in the stock if they can put in FD to earn interest with super low risk? Think about it.

Posted by Jonathan Keung > 2016-09-22 14:37 | Report Abuse

to table a motion under other matters. you need to submit the Q in writing
before the AGM

Posted by Cipta > 2016-09-22 14:51 | Report Abuse

One question can ask in the AGM is why TTB misjudge the market, misjudge not one year but successive for five years. What is the correction action by the BOD?

Posted by Jay > 2016-09-22 14:55 | Report Abuse

a broken clock pointing twelve would also be correct twice a day. TTB's bullshit crisis talk of course will come through one day, then he will come out and claim credit. at least the ethical way would have been benchmarking his fees against the fund performance

Posted by MG9231 > 2016-09-22 15:06 | Report Abuse

Posted by Cipta > Sep 22, 2016 02:51 PM | Report Abuse

One question can ask in the AGM is why TTB misjudge the market, misjudge not one year but successive for five years. What is the correction action by the BOD?


This is correct way to rectify the problems faced by shareholders. every Shareholders must stand up to ask pertinent questions and company must accomodate and satisfy them. if not what is the point having AGM.

If he misread economy a year or 2 is excusable but for continues 5 or 6 years. That fund manager must either 'cha sai' or totally incompetent. for a fund house with this type of fund manager 'die lah"
For further more, his job is to review and search for valued companies like our KC chong doing not every days talk world economics problems.

Posted by MG9231 > 2016-09-22 15:20 | Report Abuse

Even if you don't know English, during Q and A ,you can ask questions in Chinese, Malay and Tamil. A good Company will stand by interpreters, if not some helpful shareholders will help you. don't worry , think of your questions and ask him thoroughly why he miss the opportunity in last 5-6 years. or is he sleeping on his job as I guess.
Company also has to find time for Q & A . Please don't cut short the Q & A time. Don't be threaten by him time for venue is limited. That is the main purpose of having AGM.
Unlike what he do now, organise Seminars and other companies exhibitions which i think is a distractions to current shareholders.
Why shareholders money is used to sponsor rubbish events and exhibitions. All these activities are throwing shareholders money into the drain.

Posted by MG9231 > 2016-09-22 15:24 | Report Abuse

Posted by stonebridge > Sep 22, 2016 02:36 PM | Report Abuse

As a professional fund manager, even crisis also can make money do not talk about "cash is king" such a crappy statement.

The fund already lose the opportunity to make shareholders' money to work for shareholders! Why people want to invest in the stock if they can put in FD to earn interest with super low risk? Think about it.


As I said before, now you can see he is a half past 6 fund manager. Only this type of fund manager is waiting for market crash.

Posted by Jonathan Keung > 2016-09-22 15:25 | Report Abuse

the problem lies with people who attend AGm. Most shareholders ( majority) are not prepared to ask Q. Only a minority are there to ask. hopefully we can see better participation this year

Posted by Wk1983 > 2016-09-22 15:42 | Report Abuse

I think its poor performance is the main issue la (e.g. he made a very very wrong call on Parkson). I vaguely remembered last time they said the exhibition is not sponsored by the fund money (shareholder money) but it is paid by the fund mgmt house.

Can we try benchmark his fees (ard 1.5%) to be excessively high compared to peers? Can we try benchmark his poor performance against some high-performing local fund so we know the gap?

Posted by dusti > 2016-09-22 15:47 | Report Abuse

Must declare I don't hold any share here but curious bcos the strategy involved here is wait for a deep market collapse and cream the investments on recovery, and claim also, credit for wise action. Then beat the chest and shout like Tarzan and add Warren to my name. The present loser will eventually be a winner, but the never ending boom market will delay this for a bit yet.
Hard to believe that so many clever people can be stuck here for so long. Most of you could have done much better on your own. For now, it is not about what questions to ask at the AGM, but to ask yourselves what you should do NOW. I'd walk away and find a new promising company to place the money or put it under my pillow. By the sequence of events, just imagine what would happen to the share price if the market collapses.

Posted by MG9231 > 2016-09-22 15:53 | Report Abuse

Posted by ckkhen > Sep 21, 2016 09:51 PM | Report Abuse

Regarding dividend, TTB says no problem as long as majority of shareholders want it. But so far no takers.
City of London (15.7%) is the only active one. The other 14% US Fund managers keep quiet only. So do most Malaysian shareholders.

If nothing positive comes out in the AGM which I am attending, I'll sell out gradually, after all my average price is 1.81. Better take care of myself first. I advise others to cut loss if need be.


Ckken, keep in touch in I3 investors forum. Sarawak Reports Editor Clare Rewcastle Brown with internate facility only can have a good fight with our untouchable MO1. Why with internate around ,you can't fight for your rights.

Tell you, one day you may get a surprise that City of London Fund management may contact you through their brokers and buy from you off market. If they accumulate their shareholding more than 33.3% in Icap Bhd , they can buy up the whole Icap bhd at their last traded price. This is what TTB is most worrying about.

If Icap share price still persist at yesterday's closing price, that means whole Icap bhd's Market capitalization 2.35 * 144,000,000 = $338,400,000.
while RAV worth $3.13 * 144,000,000 = $450,720,000
$450,720,000 less $338,400,000 =$112,320,000 (surplus)
The surplus is the meat worth chewing.

I don't mind wait for their calls even though my shareholdings are much smaller than yours. I don't mind sell to them at lower price.

Posted by ckkhen > 2016-09-22 16:13 | Report Abuse

MG9231,
Are you attending the meeting? If you do, would like to meet you?
Calvin Tan says u re for Johore? In 2013, I remember a family from Johore(?) questioned TTB re why we were still not millionaires in spite of promising we would be soon. TTB gave bad replies to this family.

Posted by newbie81 > 2016-09-22 16:18 | Report Abuse

Simple ma one is manage by Warren buffett and another one is manage by.....

Posted by ckkhen > 2016-09-22 16:28 | Report Abuse

I have emailed KCChong's poor icap performance comment (from a recent article re unit trust/fund management) to icap Q&A at AGM so I am waiting for TTB's reply. KC's report is very accurate re poor CAGR return. By answering the questions posed (poor performane since last 5 yrs especially), then we will see what he intends to do next.

Posted by MG9231 > 2016-09-22 17:00 | Report Abuse

ckkhen,
i am not the one mentioned by you. in fact, he practically teased every one who raised questions against his wishes during AGM.

Posted by Zea XG > 2016-09-22 17:21 | Report Abuse

Actually, high liquidity strategy is not a bad plan at the moment. I myself also about 50% equity, 25% bonds and 25% cash. The problem is his management fee is too considering the current inactivity of the fund.

Posted by Zea XG > 2016-09-22 17:21 | Report Abuse

**too high

Posted by MG9231 > 2016-09-22 17:27 | Report Abuse

If he cares with shareowners (words used by him as if he is concerned the well being of shareholders) feeling, he should initial cutting his management and advisory fees long ago to compensate his mis-judgement.
he knows well he is underperformed in his duty and his mistake but he is damn thick skin. He talks only but more concern his own pocket.