Posted by soros228 > 2016-02-20 22:23 | Report Abuse

No point talking to him la.
Stubborn like stone.
I just figure out things that he is over confident might not as good as what he thinks.
Therefore I lay down examples.
He said I insult his daughter.
I won't use dirty words la Desa.

Posted by Ven Felix > 2016-02-20 22:25 | Report Abuse

There are only fun to trap Desa to prove that his brain is not there while he is comment in i3.. use my small trick easily trap a moron. I feel happy, in return , mind u to run from KeinHing Desa.

Posted by manimaniONGG > 2016-02-20 22:27 |

Post removed.Why?

Posted by Ven Felix > 2016-02-20 22:28 | Report Abuse

Swapping to Maybank , desa. Seriously, no joking.

Posted by Icon8888 > 2016-02-20 22:31 | Report Abuse

KC it is 330 am now in NZ ? Are u staying up to watch football again ? X P

Posted by kcchongnz > 2016-02-20 22:38 | Report Abuse

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 08:26 PM | Report Abuse
Desa: says....Compounding is a lie unless you are talking about fixed income....low rates of fixed income like AAA bonds.

Cool investor: says....Compound interest n modern portfolio theory are 2 different things.

Says practically the same thing.
But I get insulted, not an accountant, don't even know simple accounting, Poh LAN Pa.

Well.......if this is not attacking the messager and not the message, I don't know what is.


Me: Really, what Coolinvestor says and what you say are "practically the same thing"? Does Coolinvestor agrees with you or not?

By the way, the way you praised everything your idol says, including margin calls are good, and put down the opinions of all others, no matter how good their opinions are, is really amazing, you are a very very rare. But that is you. it is ok with me. Everybody is different anyway.

But you come to my thread here which I write about telling youngsters be wary about margin financing, the advantage of compounding, safe and invest, diversification etc., it is ok you praised your idol, as I did admired and praised him last time, but you started insulting me?


Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 19, 2016 05:35 PM | Report Abuse
If I didn't know I could have mistaken you for a unit trust salesman.........lol
KYY is a business, tycoon. Businessmen and tycoons play by a different rule book.

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 04:34 PM | Report Abuse
telling a young man to compound his wealth in the share market is the Biggest lie there ever is.

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 08:26 PM | Report Abuse
Desa: says....Compounding is a lie unless you are talking about fixed income....low rates of fixed income like AAA bonds.

Posted by Ven Felix > 2016-02-20 22:39 | Report Abuse

Desa , like it this way. This will make him feeling his is unbeatable. ....in fact he is speechless, loophole everywhere. He live in his own fantasy castle..

Posted by manimaniONGG > 2016-02-20 22:39 |

Post removed.Why?

Posted by soros228 > 2016-02-20 22:41 | Report Abuse

Well said KC.
therefore lots of people here like to attack him.

Posted by Desa20201956 > 2016-02-20 22:42 | Report Abuse

Chong

I started this conversation by saying if I didn't know better, I would have thought you are a unit trust salesman.....what is wrong with that statement.?

You know...in Malaysia, selling unit trust can be a lucrative business for some and they always do it the way you do.......by showing people a smooth exponential curve.

Anyone who has experience with the share market also know it is any thing but a smooth exponential curve....it is just a cliche. A popular cliche doesn't make it right.

Why can't I discuss this subject without being insulted?

You think you have monopoly rights to post here or what?

The other point I raised was......share market is a business, it is not a savings.....a savings account is savings. A savings account you can compound....like someone noted, share market and interest they live in different worlds.

Share market is investments....it is different from savings.
Investments is a business. It is something you do with your spare cash but also full of uncertainties and risks....no smooth exponential curve.

I think you get the point. It's like teaching grand mother sucks eggs.....I was making a joke about share market and compounding before I was rudely insulted.

Last question about measuring performance of mutual funds....that would be a gigantic topic ....sure you want to go there?

Posted by Ven Felix > 2016-02-20 22:42 | Report Abuse

Kikiki, desa play hide , while kcchongnz flex muscles.

Posted by kcchongnz > 2016-02-20 22:44 | Report Abuse

Posted by Coldrisks > Feb 20, 2016 10:32 PM | Report Abuse
poor Desa, let him go lah, so many attack one, not fair lah.....

I agree the above statement. Please do not get personal.

I wish I can discuss with him about modern portfolio theory, and all CFA matters here. That is why I don't sleep yet.

Posted by Icon8888 > Feb 20, 2016 10:31 PM | Report Abuse
KC it is 330 am now in NZ ? Are u staying up to watch football again ? X P

Posted by manimaniONGG > 2016-02-20 22:45 | Report Abuse

Wat i learned in BTC uni.
Portfolio theory is diversifation to control risk.
Compunding theory ? Its not even a theory. Its just a performance measurement.
Does desa think they belongs to same school? Its not even the field of accountants.

Posted by Ven Felix > 2016-02-20 22:47 | Report Abuse

Sound like how to differentiate a girls and boys. Is pontan count ?

Posted by manimaniONGG > 2016-02-20 22:49 |

Post removed.Why?

Posted by Desa20201956 > 2016-02-20 22:49 | Report Abuse

That is KYY business......he already says he likes to top up whenever his margin account gives him room....looking at the performance of his shares....and they are public knowledge to i3...... I don't understand why it is surprising.

Posted by Icon8888 > 2016-02-20 22:51 | Report Abuse

Looked like KC is fully prepared for a debate... Tonight will be a long night... I hope Desa won't chicken out... KC is very well verse with the topic.

Clash of the Titans !!!!!

Give me few minutes, I go seven eleven now to buy pop corn..

Posted by tabularasa > 2016-02-20 22:52 | Report Abuse

Watching 2 respected uncles argue electronically is...*face palm*

Desa has a point, the power of compounding interest diminishes for the equities market, due to its higher volatility, as opposed to fixed income, which one can hold till maturity.

This does not mean Chong's advice of starting to invest young do not apply.

Ceasefire?

Posted by Icon8888 > 2016-02-20 22:54 | Report Abuse

tabularasa view doesn't count... He is another accountant

Accountant are famous for inability to understand finance (apart from my buddy superman 99)

Posted by Ven Felix > 2016-02-20 22:54 | Report Abuse

Shares market not juz purely as investment, Its a dead pool. Its a tools to accelerate greediness especially to those with jealous mind, and go crazy ..with their nerve breaking

Posted by Desa20201956 > 2016-02-20 22:55 | Report Abuse

measuring portfolio performance.............it is such a giant topic, the CFA Institute even got a Diploma just for that. You don't want to go there.

its called the CIPM® Program


https://www.cfainstitute.org/programs/cipm/Pages/index.aspx

Posted by Icon8888 > 2016-02-20 22:58 | Report Abuse

You no substance said no substance lah

KC is waiting for you to response. Don't beat around the bush. Go straight to talk about portfolio performance management

Posted by Icon8888 > 2016-02-20 22:59 | Report Abuse

I just came back with my pop corn, u don't disappoint me

Posted by smartly > 2016-02-20 23:00 | Report Abuse

epf just declared 6.4 dividend !!!

so all, be happy huh ....!

Posted by tabularasa > 2016-02-20 23:00 | Report Abuse

Touche, Icon8888

Posted by tabularasa > 2016-02-20 23:01 | Report Abuse

In times of uncertainty, thank God for the good people over at EPF.

Posted by kcchongnz > 2016-02-20 23:04 | Report Abuse

Posted by tabularasa > Feb 20, 2016 10:52 PM | Report Abuse
Watching 2 respected uncles argue electronically is...*face palm*
Desa has a point, the power of compounding interest diminishes for the equities market, due to its higher volatility, as opposed to fixed income, which one can hold till maturity.
This does not mean Chong's advice of starting to invest young do not apply.
Ceasefire?

Good point tabularasa. I like to discuss issues. Attacking others in persons is bad, more so do not pull in family members to insult. Please stop it.

Tabularasa, market is of course volatile, in the short run. That is why speculate in the market you do in the short term, but investing must be long-term.

Stock market everywhere in the world, I mean matured and emerging markets historically have been giving a compounded annual growth rate of about 10% a year over a long period of time. Aren't we talking about investing?

Investing in the stock market at 10% CAGR becomes RM260000 in ten years, whereas putting in fixed income at 5% yields RM163000, only 70% of equity investment.

If you invest in the equity market for 20 years, it becomes RM673000, compared to RM265000 in fixed income.

So why do you say "the power of compounding interest diminishes for the equities market"?

Posted by soros228 > 2016-02-20 23:07 | Report Abuse

Desa is no where to touch KC la.
Simple as that.

Posted by kcchongnz > 2016-02-20 23:09 | Report Abuse

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 10:55 PM | Report Abuse
measuring portfolio performance.............it is such a giant topic, the CFA Institute even got a Diploma just for that. You don't want to go there.
its called the CIPM® Program


Why is it such a giant topic? I have touched on some of them before. Appreciate your input:

http://klse.i3investor.com/blogs/kcchongnz/44334.jsp
http://klse.i3investor.com/blogs/kcchongnz/44336.jsp

But I seriously don't like those stuff in Greeks in my investment.

Posted by Desa20201956 > 2016-02-20 23:11 | Report Abuse

KYY is a business, tycoon. Businessmen and tycoons play by a different rule book.

That is KYY business......he already says he likes to top up whenever his margin account gives him room....looking at the performance of his shares....and they are public knowledge to i3...... I don't understand why it is surprising.

...that brings us to the second point you raised, chong....
why you object to that truism?

business tycoons and business men have different risk tolerance....it is such as obvious statement that they play by a different rule book...what is your objection?

Posted by soros228 > 2016-02-20 23:11 | Report Abuse

How u know we are not tycoon ???

Posted by soros228 > 2016-02-20 23:12 | Report Abuse

Why only KYY is tycoon.

Posted by soros228 > 2016-02-20 23:13 | Report Abuse

This businessman ; that fellow tycoon.
Enough all these.

Posted by Desa20201956 > 2016-02-20 23:15 | Report Abuse

business tycoons and business men have different risk tolerance ( from the non businessmen, the professors etc etc....)....it is such as obvious statement that they play by a different rule book...what is your objection?

Posted by kcchongnz > 2016-02-20 23:16 | Report Abuse

Posted by Desa20201956 > Feb 20, 2016 11:11 PM | Report Abuse
KYY is a business, tycoon. Businessmen and tycoons play by a different rule book.
That is KYY business......he already says he likes to top up whenever his margin account gives him room....looking at the performance of his shares....and they are public knowledge to i3...... I don't understand why it is surprising.
...that brings us to the second point you raised, chong....
why you object to that truism?
business tycoons and business men have different risk tolerance....it is such as obvious statement that they play by a different rule book...what is your objection?

I seriously don't give a damn how much money he has made using margin finance. It is none of my business.

But I can tell you, you know very little about it because you haven't read enough. It is all over in i3investor. Don't just look at the last one year. Look at the last say 3 years.

But I can't stand people promoting youngsters and newbies to use margin finance. I also feel disgusted when you can come out and sang about it. it is bad for the society. Do you advise your son and daughter to use margin finance?

Posted by soros228 > 2016-02-20 23:17 | Report Abuse

Because I cannot tahan when he keeps saying KYY is tycoon la
KYY is businessman la.
Tell u Desa. KYY this time is lucky to escape the crash.
If the oil didn't rebound , KYY will be...........
Desa u saw all his counters dive very badly recently; mostly due to force selling.

Posted by Desa20201956 > 2016-02-20 23:17 |

Post removed.Why?

Posted by paperplane2016 > 2016-02-20 23:18 | Report Abuse

He wsnt those tht can go hell ones. 1000billionn

Posted by soros228 > 2016-02-20 23:19 | Report Abuse

Well said KC. play smart and play safe.
If Desa open margin for his kids i'll open also. 10x bigger. Hahahah.

Posted by Desa20201956 > 2016-02-20 23:19 |

Post removed.Why?

Posted by Icon8888 > 2016-02-20 23:21 | Report Abuse

KYY is flawed

The more he showed off, the more I disappointed with him

Writing an article to argue about the merit of margin call is simply silly

Posted by Icon8888 > 2016-02-20 23:22 | Report Abuse

Nothing good come out of margin call

Only a fool will argue otherwise

Posted by soros228 > 2016-02-20 23:22 | Report Abuse

Duit punya eco save one branch punya monthly income already your annual income lo.
If Duit got 50 branches. Pls count.
Do u think Duit need to borrow margin account ????

Posted by tabularasa > 2016-02-20 23:24 | Report Abuse

Mr Chong,

Since you asked, here is an example of why the law of compounding return is dimished for equities, vs fixed income:

Say you have 2 investment class - equity and fixed income, and you invested RM10,000 in both class for 10 years.

Fixed income:
Average return:7%
Investment at the end of year 10: RM19,672
Calculation:
Year 1 Year 2 Year 3 Year 4 Year 5 Year 6 Year 7 Year 8 Year 9 Year 10
Fixed income 7% 7% 7% 7% 7% 7% 7% 7% 7% 7%
10000 10700 11449 12250.43 13107.9601 14025.51731 15007.30352 16057.81476 17181.8618 18384.59212 19671.51357


Equity:
Average return:8%
Investment at the end of year 10: RM19,594
Calculation:
Equities -15% -12% 15% 14% 8% 25% -10% 10% 15% 30%
10000 8500 7480 8602 9806.28 10590.7824 13238.478 11914.6302 13106.09322 15072.0072 19593.60936

Summary:
Despite the higher average return of 8% (compared to 7%), equities actually underperformed fixed income over the above 10 year period.

You quoted CAGR earlier, my point would be that it is inappropriate to assume equities can be projected using CAGR, due to the inherent volatility.

I know the above example is fictive, but the fixed income fund manager who presented this used real example (historical bursa return vs fixed income fund).

Posted by paperplane2016 > 2016-02-20 23:25 | Report Abuse

It is common for tycoon etc to use margin lah. Even cold rye also use It mah. Surprise this kc so over reacting?

Posted by soros228 > 2016-02-20 23:26 | Report Abuse

Duit
I just give him example.
Don't look down on people.
Don't only KYY is businessman and tycoon.
The rest are small fry.

Posted by kcchongnz > 2016-02-20 23:30 | Report Abuse

Posted by paperplane2016 > Feb 20, 2016 11:25 PM | Report Abuse
It is common for tycoon etc to use margin lah. Even cold rye also use It mah. Surprise this kc so over reacting?

Don't understand what I am saying?

"I seriously don't give a damn how much money he has made using margin finance. It is none of my business.

But I can't stand people promoting youngsters and newbies to use margin finance. I also feel disgusted when you can come out and sang about it. it is bad for the society. Do you advise your son and daughter to use margin finance?"

Posted by duitKWSPkita > 2016-02-20 23:31 | Report Abuse

KC Chong and all my loved fellows (including Desa bro)

ting! ting! time out....First Round habis....
chillllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllaxxxxxxxxxxx


Here you go!


A therapist has a theory that couples who make love once a day are the happiest. So he decides to test this theory. He convenes all the couples he can find at a special seminar.

He then starts by asking the many people in the audience. “How many people here make love once a day?”
Half the people raise their hands, each of them grinning widely.

hands upraised



“Once a week?”
A third of the audience members raise their hands, their grins a bit less vibrant.

"How many of you make love once a month?” A few hands tepidly go up. No grins could be sighted.

Then he asks, “OK, how about once a year?” To his shock, one man in the back jumps up and down, jubilantly waving his hands and whistling.

The therapist is shocked—this man's reaction completely disproves his theory! “If you make love only once a year,” he asks, “why are you so happy?”

The man yells, “Today’s the day!”

Posted by Desa20201956 > 2016-02-20 23:33 |

Post removed.Why?

Posted by soros228 > 2016-02-20 23:33 | Report Abuse

KC , Desa is still very new in stock market.