Posted by Tobby > 2022-07-24 21:39 | Report Abuse

To me Luxembourg has commited huge error! They did not get valification from Phillipines if this Sultan Sulu 'heir's are officially recognise which they are not!

Posted by Tobby > 2022-07-24 21:40 | Report Abuse

Furthermore, the last remaining Sultan of Sulu which Phillipines recognised had already handover his claim to the government of Phillipines long time ago! Only Philipines has the right to the claim!

Posted by Tobby > 2022-07-24 21:42 | Report Abuse

As far as i can see, Harapan leaders are making things worse for Malaysia for this case! Instead of protecting our soverntty, Harapan leaders are too busy pushing the blame to everybody else!
Harapan leaders need to grow up! They cannot manage this nation if they are emotionally driven! Have not they learn their lessons during those lousy 22 months!

Posted by Tobby > 2022-07-24 21:42 | Report Abuse

We never had this problem before until Harapan appointed Tommy Thomas as AG! Period!

Posted by Sslee > 2022-07-24 21:48 | Report Abuse

Be mindful of Hatyai Peace Accord, Karpal says on Chin Peng's ashes
The Editor
/
TheEdge

September 17, 2013 08:53 am +08


PUTRAJAYA (Sept 17): The government should be cautious about the messsage it is sending out especially with the ratification of an international treaty should it choose not to allow Chin Peng's ashes to be brought back into the country. DAP national chairman Karpal Singh raised the Hatyai Peace Accord signed in 1990 between the governments of Malaysia, Thailand and the Malayan Communist Party (MCP) of which Chin Peng, or Ong Boon Hua, was secretary-general. Karpal said the agreement was to allow all MCP leaders to resettle in the country. So if the government does not allow Malaysia to be Chin Peng's final resting place, it would tantamount to not honouring the agreement. "This doesn't fit well for the country," he said. "The government should seriously consider allowing Chin Peng's ashes back here. That is the least the government can do. The government did not allow him a lifetime to come back here," he added. Noting the strong objection to his return following his demise on Monday, Karpal called for a different perspective on the top leader of the MCP, now that he was deceased.

Karpal also pointed out that although Chin Peng could not provide his birth certificates, the fact that he was born here could not be denied. On Prime Minister Datuk Seri Najib Razak's statement that Chin Peng was not a citizen, Karpal said it could easily be proven that he had been born in Setiawan, Perak. "Many people don't have birth certificates, but that doesn't mean he was not citizen," Karpal said. Led by Chin Peng, the MCP fought the Japanese troops with the British during the Pacific War. Karpal pointed out that one must not forget MCP's battles against the Japanese, reminding people to view this issue objectively. Chin Peng died in Bangkok at age 90 after his legal attempts to resettle in Malaysia was rejected.

Posted by Sslee > 2022-07-24 21:53 | Report Abuse

The simple fact is that BN governenmnet continues to pay annual cessation payment since independent till 2013.

Posted by Tobby > 2022-07-24 22:09 | Report Abuse

SsLee! That's the problem with Harapan leaders! Even they even protect Chin Peng despite obvious reason! Haix!
Look, Chin Peng has no birth certificate! Period!
Chin Peng brutally murdered 100k local chinese! Period!
And yet Harapan leaders continued to protect and claim Chin Peng as a victim!
Like i said many times, please grow up! Don't use the 'law' to protect nonsense!

Posted by Tobby > 2022-07-24 22:11 | Report Abuse

And please have some respect for the 100k local chinese killed by Chin Peng! We dont need a brutal murderer to be promoted as hero in Malaysia!
Don't change the history!
Do you know how many good local chinese teachers, doctors, and so forth who were killed by Chin Peng just to send a message that he is head of communist!

Posted by Sslee > 2022-07-24 22:25 | Report Abuse

When you signed an international treaty (Hatyai Peace Accord) you need to honour it. Period.

By the way in Sulu arbitration case the French arbitration court interpreted the contract as perpetual lease of Sabah hence the big sum awarded in lieu of returing Sabah back to Sulu Sultan.

By according to english law the contract is cessation of Sabah hence even Malaysia in breach of contract the remedial action is to continue with the annual cessation payment.

Once it is cessation you cannot claim back Sabah.

Posted by Sslee > 2022-07-24 22:31 | Report Abuse

Peace Agreement of Hat Yai (1989)
Agreement Between the Government of Malaysia and the Malayan Communist Party to Terminate Hostilities
Signed
2 December 1989
Location
Hat Yai, Songkhla, Thailand
Signatories
Wan Sidek Wan Abdul Rahman
General Hashim Mohd Ali
Mohammed Hanif Omar
Anek Sithipresasana
General Chavalit Yongchaiyudh
General Sawaeng Therasawat
Lieutenant General Yoodhana Yamphundu
Chin Peng
Abdullah CD
Rashid Maidin

Parties
Malaysia
Thailand
Malayan Communist Party

Posted by Sslee > 2022-07-24 22:35 | Report Abuse

The following delegates were present at the signing of the agreement in 1989:

Malaysian delegation
Wan Sidek Wan Abdul Rahman (Ministry of Home Affairs Secretary General)
General Hashim Mohd Ali (Malaysian Armed Forces Chief)
Mohammed Hanif Omar (Royal Malaysian Police, Inspector General of Police)

Thai delegation
Anek Sithipresasana (Minister of Interior Permanent Secretary)
General Chavalit Yongchaiyudh (Internal Security Operations Command (ISOC) Deputy Director)
General Sawaeng Therasawat (Royal Thai Police Director General)
Lieutenant General Yoodhana Yamphundu (Royal Thai Army 4th Army Area Commander)

Malayan Communist Party delegation
Chin Peng (MCP Secretary General)
Abdullah CD (MCP Chairman)
Rashid Maidin (MCP Central Committee Member)

Aftermath
After the signing of the 1989 peace agreement, the Malayan Communist Party was dissolved. Former members of the MCP were resettled in four villages known as Kampung Aman (Peace Village). A total of 330 former MCP members were allowed to return to Malaysia.

Those MCP members who settled in South Thailand became farmers, livestock breeders, and traders. They were able to adapt to the new environment and assimilate into the local community.

Members of The Communist Party of Malaya (CPM-ML), a splinter group of the MCP, were resettled in a Friendship Village in South Thailand known as Chulaborn Village. CPM-ML members who wanted to return to Peninsular Malaysia were required to comply with several conditions set by the government of Malaysia before being able to settle in the state of their choice.

Posted by Tobby > 2022-07-24 22:43 | Report Abuse

SsLee! Yeah, basically Sabah belongs to Sulus! Which is why the heighten alert in Sabah right now!
For me, let it be! Let there be 2nd invasion in Sabah!

Posted by Tobby > 2022-07-24 22:43 | Report Abuse

As for Chin Peng ashes, bring it back! Bury it in Harapan HQ!

Posted by Sslee > 2022-07-24 22:55 | Report Abuse

Tobby,
I am sure if Robert Kuok will to fall into Chin Peng hand after surrender of Japan army at the end of world war 2. Robert Kuok will be killed for working with Japanese company during the war.

This is how any war was fought. So never start any war.

Posted by Tobby > 2022-07-24 23:00 | Report Abuse

Hihihaha! True! Robert Kuok served many masters! That's why he is multibillionaire! He can read the terrain very well! He also somewhat new Harapan would win hence he jumped to support Harapan! Well, looked like he was game by Mahathir once again!
As for Chin Peng, he would have killed Robert Kuok for sure!

Posted by Tobby > 2022-07-24 23:05 | Report Abuse

If you read Robert Kuok history, you know he is on top of the food chain! The Brittish, Japanese, skip communist, then back to Brittish, then Umno, he served them all! Then of course serving the baby CCP in China! Boy, Robert Kuok made fortune with CCP! But i guess he has fallen since Chairman Xi took over! Chairman Xi does not like those billionaires using him like previous chairmen!
Again, Chin Peng was too egoistic! Even if he was branch of CCP, he leashed out very brutal method to rise to power! And he failed!
Remember, CCP tried to branch out to Singapore, Vietnam and many Asian countries! Vietnam is still communist nation you know! But in Vietnam, viets grew very hostile towards chinese who moved to Vietnam! Hence the war between CCP and communist viets back in the 80s!

Posted by Sslee > 2022-07-24 23:33 | Report Abuse

The Arbitrator decides that Claimants are entitled to recover from Respondent the restitution value of the rights over the leased territory along North Borneo under the 1878 Agreement and the 1903 Confirmatory Deed, with pre-award interest of 3,96% per annum, as of January 1, 2013 until 2044, and orders Respondent to pay to Claimants the amount of USD 14.92 billion; and

Tobby the awarded is for rights over the leased territory while Thomas's letter all this while mention confirmation of cession and annual cession payment hence if court accept Thomas letter as evident then there is no leased territory to start with.

The awarded is null and void as there is no lease terriotory to start with.

Posted by Sslee > 2022-07-24 23:41 | Report Abuse

6. Over time, obviously the contracting parties changed. Upon the establishment of Malaysia on 16th September 1963, Malaysia became the successor-in-title to the British Company viz. the British North Borneo Company under the 1878 Grant and Confirmation by Sultan of Sulu of Cession of Certain Islands dated 22nd April 1903 (1903 Confirmation of Cession). From 1963 to 2012, that is, for an unbroken and continuous period of 49 years, Malaysia had been, under the 1878 Grant, paying your clients (themselves the successors-in-title to the Sultan of Sulu) the annual sum 5300 dollars. The payment was increased by 300 dollars per annum by way of the 1903 Confirmation of Cession.

7. From the beginning, Malaysia paid to your clients the agreed annual sum (Cession Monies) of 5300 dollars in Malaysian Ringgit, that is, 5300 MYR. The payment of Cession Monies had been made to the rightful heirs of the Sulu Sultanate, consistent with the judgment delivered Chief Justice C.F.C Macaskie in 18th December 1939 in the High Court of the State of North Borneo in the case Dayang – Dyang Haji Piandao Kiram of Jolo, Philippines & 8 others v. The Government of North Borneo & Others [Civil Suit No 169/39]. That judgment declared that the Plaintiffs are the rightful heirs with the right over the Cessions Monies. The grounds of judgment are attached hereto as Annexure A.173

8. Malaysia had continuously paid the Cession Monies to the heirs of the Sulu Sultanate through their appointed attorney Ulka T. Ulama until 2010. For the years 2011 and 2012, the Cession Monies were paid directly to the heirs of the Sulu Sultanate and not through their appointed attorney as the Ambassador of Malaysia to the Republic of the Philippines had received complaints from the heirs to the Sulu Sultanate on the delay of payments made previously and costs charged by the attorney for such services. Due to these complaints, the Ambassador of Malaysia to the Republic of Philippines decided to make payment directly to the heirs of the Sulu Sultanate. The payment of the Cession Monies were made in Philippine Peso based on the prevailing exchange rates. A copy of letter dated 28 June 2012 from the Ambassador of Malaysia to the heirs of the Sulu Sultanate concerning the aforesaid payment is attached as Annexure B.

Posted by Tobby > 2022-07-25 01:58 | Report Abuse

SsLee! Correct! Now you are talking! Sultan Sulu never lease to British! It was a agreement of cession!

Posted by Tobby > 2022-07-25 01:59 | Report Abuse

And yes! The annual payment must be made directly to Sultan Sulu 'heirs'! But are you sure they are official 'heir's ! Becuase, Phillipines never recognise the illegamates!

Posted by Tobby > 2022-07-25 02:01 | Report Abuse

The original agreement was written in bahasa jawi if i am not mistaken! But English translation was incorrect! The word 'pajakan' was never meant to say to lease! Perhaps in olden days, 'pajakan' was actually to sell!

Posted by Tobby > 2022-07-25 02:02 | Report Abuse

Honestly, the 'heirs' can sue until they go bankrupt!

Posted by Michael Kwok > 2022-07-25 11:21 | Report Abuse

bn there no such sulu invasion.After anwar comeback maybe sulu people anwar accomplice.win election ge15.ph comeback just many tricks there ply.

Posted by Tobby > 2022-07-25 12:37 | Report Abuse

Michael! Anwar very close to those concunbines 'heirs'! It's reported that Anwar instigate 2013 invasion to create chaos in Malaysia!

Posted by Tobby > 2022-07-25 12:38 | Report Abuse

I beginning to see why so many politicians rejecting Anwar to be come PM! He is such a trouble maker!

Posted by stockraider > 2022-07-25 12:57 | Report Abuse

Get the facts right mah!

The british rent sabah from the sulus mah!

As long as the rent are paid.....the sulus cannot intervene with sabah loh!

But year 2012, msia govt under najib, refuse to pay rental....thus the contract of perpetuity is claimed terminated loh!

So the sulus sue msia & won USD 15B mah!
But this is a private litigation, no sovereign issue is involve loh!

As long as msia, willing to settle USD 15B for sabah issue to the sulus or philipines there will be no issue loh!

Of course msia is not willing to pay this huge sum....thus msia govt appealing loh!

The issue is how much is the quantum of damages msia govt must pay loh!

It all rest with the appealed court outcome loh!

Lu tau boh ?

Posted by Tobby > 2022-07-25 12:59 | Report Abuse

Raider! There's wrong translation of the original agreement! 'Pajakan' means cession not lease! The initially translation used the word lease! However there was further agreement in 1903 that statement the Sulus made full cession of Sabah!

Posted by Michael Kwok > 2022-07-25 14:15 | Report Abuse

Anwar ply many trick.DAP also.
MH 370,the soviet shot down our plane the invasion of part sabah all PH tricks.Somemore pastor missing and few others(keadilan tricks),the pig head throw into mosque by the dap tricks.
Trying too create chaos to bring down bn.

Posted by stockraider > 2022-07-25 14:23 | Report Abuse

Remember this loh!

Whether Sabah is own by brunai or sulus....the conclusion is the same for msia mah!

The fact that the British has an agreement with the Sulus....and everything is fine with the agreement until Msia refuse to pay the rental....means the british has done it right & valid mah!

The najib govt blow it mah!

Right now....the damages of USD 15b already establish....the question how could msia govt mitigate the situation leh ??

Msia only pays nominal Rm 6k per annum.....now the Court says msia need to pays usd 15b ...for termination of contract for none payment of rental loh!

Whether berunai govt, or philipine govt or sulus own sabah....it is immaterial....bcos the court conclude if msia willing to pay USD 15b....everything will be settled mah!

Of course msia refuse to pay such a staggering sum loh!

The question....is how much should msia govt pays loh!

This is to be decided by the court during the appeal loh!

Lu tau boh ?

Posted by Michael Kwok > 2022-07-25 14:33 | Report Abuse

Please read.People must see.so many thing happen led by PH people.especially my statement above.

Posted by stockraider > 2022-07-25 14:43 | Report Abuse

Correct loh....Najib , Muhhidin & Ismail should mainly be blame loh!

Yes Mahathir should be partly to be blame too mah!

But then, people like muhhidin & Ismail should quickly addressed the issue mah!

This show the ketuanan elite leaders are useless, they just want to politicking, in order to score points instead of taking care of the country well being loh!

Posted by stockraider > 2022-07-25 14:45 | Report Abuse

This is not a matter of u trust or no trust loh!

If they can enforced the court decisions, u r screwed mah!

Posted by qqq3333 > 3 minutes ago | Report Abuse

I don't trust the white men / and the french court................. they talk law but with intention to eat your dinner.

Posted by Tobby > 2022-07-25 15:29 | Report Abuse

Qqq! Bingo!

Posted by Musang King > 2022-07-25 19:08 | Report Abuse

What agreements also useless. If a Strong Government don't want to pay, even if you sue them up to the UN, also useless. From 19th Century up to 1947, Chinese Emperors and Chinese Komintang Government made so many Bonds Agreements promising to pay all Bond Holders their hard earned money they lent to the Chinese Government during that time. until now, China only chosen to pay some of the 1913 Bond Debts to the British Bond Holders in 1997. The rest of the Bond Holders in millions never get a cent back until today. The Bonds are all printed in Bold Colours with the Chinese Government Imperial Hand Signatory Chops. I have a few of these Bonds Certificates. Until today, Chinese Government do not want to pay. What can you do? Referring to all these Sovereign Debts that USA has a lot. Search Google, you will find out.

Posted by Musang King > 2022-07-25 19:12 | Report Abuse

The story begins nearly 100 years ago, in 1913, when the government of China began issuing bonds to foreign investors and governments for infrastructure work to modernize the country. As the country fell into civil war in 1927, paying these debts became increasingly difficult and the government fell into default. Even so, in April 1938, the Nationalist government of China began to issue U.S.-dollar denominated bonds to finance the war against Japan's brutal invasion.

Locked in a pitched battle for survival, the government issued these bonds into 1940. As part of its wartime financial aid, the U.S. government further provided a $500 million credit to China in March 1942, shipping gold there and helping to stabilize the currency. In return, it appears that the U.S. government redeemed some of these dollar-denominated bonds. But China doesn't appear to have repaid this debt either, according to State Department records, and the declaration of the People's Republic of China in 1949 ended decades of political, military and financial cooperation.

While successor governments are usually bound by the debts of predecessor governments, the new Communist government refused to pay any of these claims. The issue lay dormant for decades, just as the bilateral relationship did. Then, in 1979, as part of normalizing relations, Washington released government financial claims regarding the expropriation of American property and appears to have dropped the matter of the war debt entirely. However, it is one thing for government decision-makers to let go of government debt, however questionable that is.

Posted by Musang King > 2022-07-25 19:17 | Report Abuse

The above bonds debts are even newer than the Sulu agreement you all talking about. If our government is strong like China, why bother to talk. Wasting time and energy. All of you.

Posted by Musang King > 2022-07-25 19:20 | Report Abuse

https://www.asiafinancial.com/us-calls-for-payment-on-qing-dynasty-bonds-worth-1-6-trillion

Posted by Musang King > 2022-07-25 19:22 | Report Abuse

http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/worldbiz/archives/2002/04/23/0000133100

Posted by nicholas99 > 2022-07-26 09:46 | Report Abuse

When british cease control. why sulu no come up front and demand? now only talk.. celaka.. orang sudah merdeka.. baru mahu cakap raja sulu.. now many monarchy gg.. still dare talk raja sulu. even if they able to get back the land. one day also kena bring down. some more, they never govern the place before..

Last time their raja sulu lineage gone already.. then the government put new guy to continue their raja sulu lineage. don't know he is true heir or not.

Posted by Musang King > 2022-07-26 12:49 | Report Abuse

855 posts

Posted by Musang King > 0 seconds ago | Report Abuse

Why? Because we have people inside Malaysia poked and added fire to it. Maybe got share if successful. I guess everybody knows. Just make don't know.

Posted by Musang King > 2022-07-26 15:55 | Report Abuse

nicholas99 : When british cease control. why sulu no come up front and demand? now only talk.. celaka.. orang sudah merdeka.. baru mahu cakap raja sulu.. now many monarchy gg.. still dare talk raja sulu. even if they able to get back the land. one day also kena bring down. some more, they never govern the place before..

Last time their raja sulu lineage gone already.. then the government put new guy to continue their raja sulu lineage. don't know he is true heir or not.

CORRECT. IF SULU CAN DIG OUT OLD ISSUE TO DEMAND, THEN ALL THE RAJA RAJA AND OUTDATED SULTANS THAT MALAYSIA DO NOT RECOGNISE ALSO COME OUT TO DEMAND. I BELIEVE THERE ARE MANY OUT THERE.

Posted by Michael Kwok > 2022-07-26 16:58 | Report Abuse

No.no.no.is anwar and lge people plying tricks.from plane down to people loss to pig head into mosque.

Posted by Michael Kwok > 2022-07-26 17:10 | Report Abuse

Can u imagine the twisted king,lge.if study probably u all know.one example telling people must fully resign if under investigation except membership.but resign 1 position get 3 positions.

Posted by Musang King > 2022-07-26 18:51 | Report Abuse

One day, Malaysia will be separated for sure like how Russia was and how India was, by the Whites. There are signs of weaknesses in our present government unless we stay firmly close to China. Only China can help us Malaysia. China is extremely strong now, not like before WW2. China experienced this before but survived except the Taiwan issue only. Get advices from China. Everybody will be quiet. Now you all know, ex-PM good and close to China have a reason.

Posted by CSOON 77 > 2022-07-26 20:00 | Report Abuse

Malay sia very insolence they always follow Holland

Posted by The_JQuestion > 2022-07-26 22:45 | Report Abuse

HHHAHAHA i can see UMNO mentality here ... makes me wonder who is running this site for
well look at equity and everything else our gov is nvr going up :)
invasion always a threat nvr a non threat everybody will watch..malaysia a weak country will have no defence! all wan easy life and makan corrupt thats it continue support this way we are doom anyways make others rich and urself poor

Posted by nicholas99 > 2022-07-27 08:58 | Report Abuse

sulus just want the oil sabah have... you think they care about the land and the people?

Posted by nicholas99 > 2022-07-27 11:23 | Report Abuse

UK deal with the SULUS. not our deal. so.. move on. Qin Dynasty gg. New government also no honor. So.. same with us..

Posted by Musang King > 2022-07-27 12:06 | Report Abuse

Yes, to hell to all the old dynasties and old governments. We are the present. Take good care of our present situations. Got war, let's fight. Got foods, let's eat. Got money, let's use. Move on. We should not delve with the past. Move on, Malaysia. Nothing can stop us moving on.

Posted by stockraider > 2022-07-27 12:25 | Report Abuse

Rubbish lah!

We should follow on order make mah!

Suppose The british granted us independence more than 60 yrs ago approved by UN, now countries like Indonesia, Phillipine, Thailand say to hell with the agreement loh!...they will not honor the Msia Independence & they will want to claim back part of msia, can or not leh ?

That will be Chaos if people do not fellow rule of law mah!

That will be war mah!

What msia need to do....now is to fight the court case ....by appealing legally loh!

If the final court decide to pay USD 15b.....then msia need to pay loh!

Hopefully...Msia no need to pay so much loh!