Should I still rate iCAP governance A+ ?

Fish shareholders contact for personal agenda???....what an insult...Anyhow, I have published the 3 things I hope to see changes, the so called personal agenda. Also please look into the shareholdings information. We are even now. 😂😂

Some small guys lose money way faster investing themselves than putting money in managed funds or EPF.
What is worst is they got scammed.

Most logical is to put an Index fund and leave it there without touching it. There is an index fund called FBMKLCI-EA, they track KLCI and also pay dividend very regularly. Even though KLCI lost about 20% but the cumulative dividend is about 35-40% for past 10 years, there is a nett gain but of course teruk jugak lah.

So whenever they are stumbled upon gods-big or small, they will grab and hang on to them religiously.

Nothing wrong with the fund manager actually except he is getting very arrogant and picking fights every where and offended a lot of people. I felt so bad when he trashed his subscribers' by publishing their letters as if it is a naked public canning. People write to you in private, why reply in public? He just make more enemies faster thank making friends. Now there is an uprising. But he is getting more paranoid because he keep thing there are white masters behind it.

My advice to him is go to ancestor hall and reflect.

“Don't do unto others what you don't want done unto you.”
Confucius

My apology to @Income. The 3 are not referring him. The 3 are 3i, John and patient investor. ICap subscribers are not allowed to do copy and paste. If you see John's post on iCap here, they are reproduced in exact words without a single mistake. He has the ori copy of ICAP.

Also by i3lurker....got drown in my messages...

>>>>>>
I had never believed in managed funds.
Not even EPF.

///If he loses, he will have an advantage not enjoyed by most ordinary stock traders.
He will have something to comfort him in his poverty stricken old age.
He will have somebody to blame besides himself. ///

Sorry guys/gals

repost what dumbMoney. His message lost in my typhoon day.

Read this
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

The proposed DRIP intention to issue shares at a discount is supposed to be an incentive and reward for loyal shareholders at the expense of those who take cash instead. But this has the unintended consequence of contributing to the discount. Smart investors who opt for cash can game the system with a risk less arbitrage, subscribe for the DRIP at a discount and sell the equivalent amount of mother shares at market price. This can continue until DRIP discount is no longer wide enough to make the arbitrage profitable. This is an old trick before share trading went scripless. After a share went ex rights or bonus, controlling shareholders have the market to themselves because they can get hold of the new split shares immediately, while others have to send theirs in for registration and splitting, which can take up to a month under the rules. So pump and dump operations were so easy to do in an illiquid market.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

A gentleman. He didn't wash iCAP dirty linens in public. He is more of a geek to me. He is more interested to expound the finance theory than attacking the fund manager

You have seen how I extracted from dumbMoney on COL...he was very quiet about it until I read in between the lines and asked him more

Attacking me means there are truths in what I write...I only rely on public records....completely handicapped and have no help at all from anyone. Only trying to connect the dots. I never know the rubbish I wrote can be treated as a threat to him. A big mistake by attacking me.

I have completed lost my respects for him when he sent his 3 machais to attack me this morning

Please stop making more suicide bombers out of his followers.....

These are 3 agendas I am after if it is labelled as personal hidden agenda....

What I hope to see changes are simple:

1. Apologize to those been affected directly and indirectly by iCAP lost decade. He can keep his 78 million fund fees since 2012. No one is interested ever to claw back from him.

2. Cake B.

The title is : HOW TO HAVE YOUR CAKE AND STILL EAT IT?

Good! except the fund manager forgot to ask, which cake?

CAKE A: DIVIDEND + CAPITAL APPRECIATION

CAKE B: DIVIDEND+CAPTIAL APPRECIATION+ICAP PUT(SBB WHEN IT IS A SCREAMING BUY)

"BETTER IS THE ENEMY OF GOOD" VOLTAIRE

3. To reconsider Tan Mun Lin appointment - She is an Executive Director of CDAM, meaning someone has all the executive power in CDAM that may not be completely perceived independent even though she will hold as an Non-Independent Non-Executive of iCAP. It is a common sense that a person needs to clean and seen to be clean. Anyone with highest integrity, when in doubt or confronted with grey areas, they will always remove themselves so that CAN BE SEEN CLEAN.

A professional poker player will never be foolish to going ALL IN after looking into their odds of winning. Those names that being flashed on the roadshow are Pros.....it's an unfair advantage that little guys listen to someone who has10X of their brain size and treat him like stock market God....The are simply over-powered. They listened and believed in him because of his charisma not because of his logics. I am one of them but recently found out I have been cuci otak for too long...wish to let everyone to hear a balance view. They can see what I write and made decision themselves...what is best for them.

Using closing down fund as a blackmailing is unfair....just like Dr. M claimed he has no successor, no one can ever replace him. Shed famous tears on the stage. See what happened today? Please do not throw away trust and reputation that have been built of 50 years. I got a bit of respect for him when I opened up the e-mail of his talk yesterday about having the cake and still can eat it at the same time. I thought he begins to listen to the plights of his followers.

Siapa makan cili, tentu rasa pedas.

Usual tactics will follow, roadshow, online, soon each shareholder will receive phone calls... Who has the advantage????

For those have been sown with hatred speech... Please wake up. Also those who are buying recently betting the fund will close down, you will be disappointed. After AGM, iCap will still in one piece, perfectly in tact.

Actually no one here ever mentioned about winding up icapital. This is the chance of closing a fund if based on the persistent discounts
Discounts/Chance
10% Zero chance
11-20% 10% success rate chance
21-30 20-25% success rate chance
31-40% 30-40% chance
41-50% 50-50%
51-60% 60-70%
> 60% basket case... Days are numbered

iCAP people. Please check your reports.

CDAM(shareholder 22?)/CD Sdn Bhd(shareholder 30?) reported in 2023 Annual Report(page 59) as at 23/8/2023, they have (1,161,500+937,900) = 2,099,400 shares.

Then on 1/9/2023 made announcement for intention to deal during closed period.

https://www.bursamalaysia.com/market_information/announcements/company_announcement/announcement_details?ann_id=3382528

The company declared it has 2,993,100 shares. That is an increase of 893,700 shares.

Including of 23/8/2023 and 1/9/2023, total trading days = 7, total volume in the market was 403,300 shares. CDAM/CD S/B and etc so geng, they can buy more than total market volume. Give you a helping hand: COL bought 132,000 shares on 28/8/2023. So I don’t how iCAP or CDAM can give birth to additional so many shares.

Suspected either got recording errors or under-declare, correct it before AGM to save yourself some embarrassments.

Take it as a compliment. Thanks. The 3 of you, can't argue on logics. Upgrade to next level. Personal attack. Welcome.

While got stuck in the airports due flight delayed, I finally can study @dumbMoney post quietly. You have done a great job in proposing various scenarios how shareholder value can be enhanced. The 4% dividend payout in different forms also taken consideration of equivalent to iCAP proposed in their innovative dividend model that essentially pricing in a perpetual 24% discounts to NAV. You have remained very neutral to consider all options unlike the fund manager doing only a hard sell of 1 Choice and 1 Cake. 😂😂

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
These are my computations under various assumptions and alternatives Paying dividends either in cash or shares have no effect on shareholders' wealth, but a SBB increases the NAV of the remaining shares, depending on the amount of SBB and the price discount. https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/y8sacaao3nejubp1owmor/iCap-dividend-policy-alternatives.xls?rlkey=nf1d2ldsdu5m6cuq5m38nj2lq&dl=0

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

I have expanded your thoughts to apply on iCAP PUT by looking into a bear market scenario. This is a scenario of 1 bear market, 1 year and not all the years. Hopefully nobody twists this.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Outstanding shares 140,000,000

Assuming NAV @ 11/10/23 $3.54, Total NAV = 495,000,000

Share price $ 2.69 (Discount = 24%)

-----------------------------------------------------------
Assuming during a big crisis, iCAP NAV fell by 20%
Bear market NAV = $ 2.83
Discounts got worst, 40%, Share price = $ 1.42
Use budgeted $ 15,000,000 to do iCAP PUT, purchase 10,563,380(almost 7.5% share buy back)
Outstanding shares = 129,436,620

When market went back to normal at NAV 3.54, Total NAV = 480,000,000(going back to same baseline comparison)

Per share NAV after SBB = $ 3.71

At same 24% discount, project share price = $ 2.82

Price increase of 4.8% (2.82-2.69/2.69)

This why iCAP PUT is a no brainer and essentially what WB is doing. He doesn’t put SBB on automatic, some year he bought back a lot, and some year almost not buying back anything.

https://ycharts.com/companies/BRK.A/stock_buyback

PS. There is no need to talk about reduced management fees due to lower NAV because the fund manager has already proposed dividend, same amount of cash RM 15,000,000 will be deducted anyway.

Mathematically it makes so much sense to me. I hope stakeholders will stay rational to do the right things.

The fund manager will organize an online talk today at 12 pm, today.

The title is : HOW TO HAVE YOUR CAKE AND STILL EAT IT?

Good! except the fund manager forgot to ask, which cake?

CAKE A: DIVIDEND + CAPITAL APPRECIATION

CAKE B: DIVIDEND+CAPTIAL APPRECIATION+ICAP PUT(SBB WHEN IT IS A SCREAMING BUY)


"BETTER IS THE ENEMY OF GOOD" VOLTAIRE

Gone fishing...catch up later.

Too bad we can only talk about this and for sure we don't have the money to go to court enforce it🤐

My beloved fund manager always preach "seek truth from facts" by quoting chairman Mao

OIC, at first I suspected you are from COL😂😂 Clear to me now

This adding a very interesting twist to the plot. No wonder he will resist the SBB till the end. Treasury shares can't vote.

If true, this is a shrewd plan, increased control, taking fees from both sides perhaps even fixing some discounts issues but terrible governance. 😎

It's very difficult to get this information from the annual report...

Perhaps this is the plan engineered by the fund manager that can sent the share price soaring and tighten his grips when comes to proxy fights. All the proxy will be his. Rumors: CDAM, Tunku Sara plus his discretionary accounts already exceeded 5%.

Haha... 😝

If you happen to see Mr Tan, send my regards to him. 😊

I am requesting the fund manager do not treat ICAP as an adopted son and favored his another beloved son.

They knew exactly it's a screaming buy and they bought on behalf of private clients but refused to buy on behalf of shareholders.

I will show you since 2008, CDAM timed it perfectly and buy some shares of iCAP

2012 is the year that many shareholders starts to get trapped and cannot exit due to perpetual discounts or exit by giving up the hope share price and NAV at 30-40% discount. and the fund manager keep blaming COL.. Even a guy get to buy at lower price like Kukubird got frustrated... Many are like him. Manager get to collect fees for the past so many years and don't feel pain. This the reason of starting point of 2012. I am hoping to hear the word sorry, I feel your pain.

I am hope there will be people bring this up during AGM

Even they do drip, shareholders missed the period of 2/share.

They are buying for private clients knowing its below intrinsic value yet refused to accept mandate from shareholders to do SBB.

Found additional information about CDAM.

https://www.cdam.biz/board-of-directors/

1. Tan Teng Boo. MD of CDAM
2. Dr. Tunku Sara Binti Tunku Ahmad Yahya. She has 2.6 million shares in iCap
3. Tan Yuen-Lin. He is the son of TTB
4. Tan Mun Ling. Executive Director and Fund Manager.

TTB has direct interest of 65,000 shares and 2.9 million indirect interest via Capital Dynamics Asset Management Sdn. Bhd., Capital Dynamics Global Private Limited, Capital Dynamics Sdn. Bhd. and his sister-in-law, Fong San Lai pursuant to Section 8(4) of the Companies Act 2016 (the Act).

https://www.bursamalaysia.com/market_information/announcements/company_announcement/announcement_details?ann_id=3389629

They have been actively buying shares including for private clients but refused to accept mandate to do SBB on behalf of iCAP shareholders. Why? Open to all for comments.

I have some questions to ask if someone is holding shares under nominee account of a stock broker or CDAM. Are they a member of a company? Can they vote in the coming AGM?

****Correction*** To be fair to the fund manager, I should add back RM 28 million on the dividend declared in year 2021, hence the incremental value created = RM 84 million + RM 28 million = RM 112 million for the RM 78 million fees received. Fair is fair. My apology for the oversight.

Throughout the period as a shareholder, when I received iCAP annual report, it will left unopened. After a while, it would go into rubbish bin. Simple, I trust the fund manager, no need to read them. Recently, I begin to read the again because I felt there are some truths in what people complaints. Fees for example, many talked about %, too abstract. But I was shocked to find out in real money, shareholders paid about RM $ 78 million fees while market cap increase about RM 80 million. Being generous inclusive of 4% share price jumped today. All the answer we get is I am a victim, blame the penjajah kulit putih.......shareholders would expect a minimum of apology. It looks like more and more like the old government masking the performance issue with 3Rs issue.

Year ***Fund Management Fee*** Investment advisory Fee***Total
2012****2,894,863 **** 2,894,863 **** 5,789,726
2013**** 3,089,891 *********** 3,089,891********** 6,179,782
2014**** 3,109,491******** 3,109,491*********** 6,218,982
2015**** 3,187,354******** 3,187,354********** 6,374,708
2016**** 3,075,342******* 3,075,342 ********** 6,150,684
2017***** 3,263,523****** 3,263,523********** 6,527,046
2018***** 3,592,787****** 3,592,787 ******** 7,185,574
2019***** 3,596,061****** 3,596,061******* 7,192,122
2020***** 3,329,391****** 3,329,391****** 6,658,782
2021***** 3,033,182****** 3,033,182***** 6,066,364
2022***** 3,562,242****** 3,562,242****** 7,124,484
2023***** 3,455,641****** 3,455,641****** 6,911,282
Total 78,379,536

Market Cap 2012 308,000,000
Market Cap 2023 392,000,000
Change 84,000,000

I am merely a normal novice investor, explain to all why 2 lines? Please do not pass the bucks to me

I have reasons to believe the numbers are getting higher than this, accumulating more after 23/08/23...Let's wait for 1 more year and see.

Why 2 lines?

Annual Report 2023, page 59
22. CAPITAL DYNAMICS ASSET MANAGEMENT SDN BHD 1,161,500
30. CAPITAL DYNAMICS ASSET MANAGEMENT SDN BHD 937,900

I smell rats, they have something to hide.

Your fund manager company CDAM accumulated 1.4 millions shares..or 1.4% control now.

2023 Annual Report page 36

TAN MUN LIN
• Non-Independent Non–Executive Director
• Member of the Nomination Committee (“NC”)
• Aged 36, Malaysian, Female
Ms Tan Mun Lin was appointed to your Board of Directors
on 11 January 2021. She holds the Capital Markets Services
Representative Licence issued by the Securities Commission
of Malaysia (SC) and is licensed as a representative by the
Securities and Futures Commission of Hong Kong (SFC), both
for the regulated activity of fund management.

Ms Tan is a fund manager and Executive Director of Capital
Dynamics Asset Management Sdn Bhd. She also serves as
the deputy group CEO of Capital Dynamics, an investment
advisory and fund management group licensed by the SC, the
Monetary Authority of Singapore, the Australian Securities and
Investments Commission and the SFC.

Ms Tan has more than 14 years of experience in the
regulated investment advisory and fund management
industry. She possesses extensive experience in local and
global investment research and analysis, legal, regulatory
& compliance, marketing/business development, HR,
operations, strategy and management.
Ms Tan started her career in Capital Dynamics as Executive
Assistant to CEO (Investment Research) in September 2009.
She graduated with Bachelor of Commerce and Bachelor of
Laws from the University of Sydney in 2009.

Ms Tan Mun Lin has no family relationship with any director or
major shareholder of your Fund nor has any possible conflict
of interest with your Fund save as disclosed that she is also
the Executive Director of your Fund Manager. She has not
been convicted of any offence (other than traffic offence, if
any) within the past five (5) years nor any public sanctions
or penalty imposed by relevant regulatory bodies during
the financial year. She attended six (6) Board of Directors’
Meetings held in the financial year ended 31 May 2023.

Also been warned that I am a wanted man, can appear on a big presentation screen as public enemy #1. Don't appear.

Is the board really independent?

That control has been a talk of the town when I pointed Tan Mun Ling is someone is working in CDAM. I need to go through the annual report and see.. Whoever has more information, please share.