Posted by CFTrader > 2016-01-10 08:44 | Report Abuse

http://new.medicine.com.my/2015/12/the-changing-landscape-of-junior-doctor-jobs-in-malaysia-iv/

http://pagalavan.com/

Posted by Bruce88 > 2016-01-10 09:09 | Report Abuse

Salute for what ever reason !

Posted by buddyinvest > 2016-01-10 09:34 | Report Abuse

As usual, some try to take advantage. I also wonder why so many would like to do it overseas. Taiwan is a popular destination. Aiyah, best is still in Malaysia. A local degree is as good as the one that is obtained overseas. Ultimately, the future is actually dependent on that person who either knows or doesn't know how to apply what they have learned into practice (monetise what they know).

Posted by buddyinvest > 2016-01-10 09:50 | Report Abuse

My colleague has recently approached me to help him to prepare the "Statement by Student" for his daughter. My colleague and his wife are both senior accountants, and have owned several shop lots which give them good rentals. But greed is greed. They also want to apply for scholarships for their daughter. The statement is carefully prepared to attain the scholarships.

Posted by buddyinvest > 2016-01-10 09:51 | Report Abuse

Hats off Uncle KYY who knows how to monetise his skills. He uses the following chemistry formula to convert his skills into money.

Skills + talents + O2 = Money + Happiness + Helping the poor

High respect & high regards for KYY

Posted by fayeTan > 2016-01-10 11:18 | Report Abuse

hi Mr Koon, financially your points are valid. But the parents/students are pricing in the "emotional" premium in order to be able to boast... It certainly feels good to be able to say "I study medicine" or "My son/daughter study medicine".

Posted by chantp88 > 2016-01-10 11:28 | Report Abuse

Studying medicine is not what is used to be 20 years ago. There is oversupply of medical colleges in Malaysia and oversupply of junior doctors.

Posted by Koon Bee > 2016-01-10 11:30 | Report Abuse

Be more realistic...not neccessary to become a doctor only can be proud of...seems like many parents are pushing their luck too far taking advantage on this foundation...Uncle Kyy is right, for rm500k, you could sponsor 5-10 students on other courses compare to just 1 medical student...charity is helping on quantity and not quality...thanks Uncle KYY

Posted by Koon Bee > 2016-01-10 11:33 | Report Abuse

Humpreyliew...your point are not valid...i have fews customer applying personal loan with me and they are doctor with earning rm5000 only. I dont know they have other part time or whatever, as far as i concern, their financially are also very tight because of paying back their study loan.

Posted by Humpreyliew > 2016-01-10 11:33 | Report Abuse

Ridiculous. Are you telling us that just because you can't sponsor medical students that they should pursue courses that have zero prospect in market? You have tons of finance, accountancy graduates out there. Do you see any unemployed medical graduates? Do you see doctors driving protons? KYY assumptive that doctors doing full time job in government hospital but in real situation, doctors are doing part time in many private clinics. KYY only look at the basic salary of a doctor, but government provide many perks that can add up doctor salary more than 10k a month. And while working in government hospitals, many pursue advance courses to become specialists doctors. KYY is giving bad advise

Posted by chantp88 > 2016-01-10 11:37 | Report Abuse

There used to be only 3 medical schools to training doctors but now more than 40 medical colleges. Therefore, oversupply.. and lack of training facilities for new doctors to learn...

There are too many doctors that government had to put them on shift duties (working 8 hours a day only), making the training process worse...

Posted by PlsGiveBonus > 2016-01-10 11:40 | Report Abuse

If they didn't become dotter, how can they make enough money to help the poor when they are rich?
Because they want to make money

Posted by Koon Bee > 2016-01-10 11:41 | Report Abuse

I urge whoever that complain on uncle Kyy foundation, pls review how many student have you sponsor in your life or how much money/time have you spend for charity in your life...if no, you better shut up and dont make any complain.

Posted by PlsGiveBonus > 2016-01-10 11:41 | Report Abuse

Too bad the sense of medical dotter is strong in certain culture, and how are you gonna make a change to it?
I would suggest sponsoring to the student who interested to pursue higher English because all of them failed the most basic grammar test

Posted by PlsGiveBonus > 2016-01-10 11:42 | Report Abuse

English is a better money making career than dotter

Posted by Humpreyliew > 2016-01-10 11:45 | Report Abuse

Same thing happen to my niece. Many of her friends advise her to drop her medical course. But she pursue it with full government scholarship in UK. After graduate, she didn't come back instead was offered to work in there. 10 years later, her friends are struggle with their finance, accountancy careers. Accountant work is very tedious and the pay even with overtime cant even reach 5k a month. And there's oversupply of accountant and finance graduate. Many even work as cashiers in supermarket because they cant get job.
As for my niece, happy to report that she is pursuing her specialist course in plastic surgery. While doing that, she already finish paying her 1 million bungalow in Shah Alam

Posted by chantp88 > 2016-01-10 11:47 | Report Abuse

Dont become to make money...

Posted by Probability > 2016-01-10 11:48 | Report Abuse

I TOTALLY AGREE agree with this advise from KYY , it has been running on my mind for ages. Guys please stop justifying by having the illusion of superiority of the title 'doctor'....remember they survive on patients.

Humans are so psychologically influenced on their motivation..and they became totally blind to the fundamentals of economics.

They keep creating children without having secured their future....not realizing the childrens would NOT be having the same potential to grow their money (or any investment like education or job) like they did.

Population = 'consumption demand', eventually has to reach an equilibrium...growth in consumption will approach ZERO eventually...investments for future returns may not make sense anymore in future.

Posted by ganasai > 2016-01-10 11:48 | Report Abuse

when use money to value a doctor, then should not be. uncle should not say because no good prospect then dont want to help. who is really poor but has good study result then should get help.

Posted by chinaman > 2016-01-10 11:51 | Report Abuse

no need waste money studying...everyone can make money learning from all the SIFU in this forum like KYY, Calvin, icon8888, ayam tua, so many others...i start making money since joining this forum. THANK YOU very much to all SIFU, SIMOK

Posted by kl foong > 2016-01-10 11:52 | Report Abuse

Become doctors just to make money ?

Posted by Icon8888 > 2016-01-10 11:55 | Report Abuse

I always suspected moon bee is a banker (super senior one)

that is how he get to know so many big taukehs

koon bee I must butter you more, hopefully one day can get personal loans

Posted by Koon Bee > Jan 10, 2016 11:33 AM | Report Abuse

Humpreyliew...your point are not valid...i have fews customer applying personal loan with me and they are doctor with earning rm5000 only. I dont know they have other part time or whatever, as far as i concern, their financially are also very tight because of paying back their study loan.

Posted by chinaman > 2016-01-10 11:55 | Report Abuse

yes.....private hospital only entertain patients with medical card...no money will be discharged asap...1st question when admitted to hospital: do you have medical card to kill you with exorbitant charge

Posted by Humpreyliew > 2016-01-10 11:55 | Report Abuse

And becoming a doctor is not just about making money. My niece ambition is to open free clinics all over Malaysia when she come back 10 years later. She can do this as her pay in UK is high. She can work for 10 years in UK which is equivalent to 40 years in Malaysia. But in only 10 years, she can already retire and pursue her goal to help malaysians. She is much more valuable than her friends who are only interested in making money. Life is not about money alone. If you measure life in money value then you are not worth a life

Posted by Probability > 2016-01-10 11:56 | Report Abuse

ganasai...kl foong....it seems u have some prejudice on 'money' just the way u have some 'nobleness' feeling on Doctor. Please 'wake up'!..

Perhaps it becomes clearer to you, if one replaces the word 'money generation' with 'value addition' to the society, which is both perfectly the same.

Posted by Humpreyliew > 2016-01-10 11:57 | Report Abuse

What is helping 300 students your whole life when as a doctor you can help 300 a day. A doctor is God greatest gift.

Posted by Icon8888 > 2016-01-10 12:00 | Report Abuse

doctor is more than money

it is good karma - you help others while making big bucks

for me, doctor is the person I respect most

next is banker (like Koon Bee)

Posted by Icon8888 > 2016-01-10 12:02 | Report Abuse

Like Like Like x 1,000 times

this is exactly how I feel about it

Posted by Humpreyliew > Jan 10, 2016 11:55 AM | Report Abuse

And becoming a doctor is not just about making money. My niece ambition is to open free clinics all over Malaysia when she come back 10 years later. She can do this as her pay in UK is high. She can work for 10 years in UK which is equivalent to 40 years in Malaysia. But in only 10 years, she can already retire and pursue her goal to help malaysians. She is much more valuable than her friends who are only interested in making money. Life is not about money alone. If you measure life in money value then you are not worth a life

Posted by chantp88 > 2016-01-10 12:04 | Report Abuse

if you are in for the money, then you are in the wrong profession.

Posted by Humpreyliew > 2016-01-10 12:04 | Report Abuse

If you really want to make big money in life and not spend much, then chef is your best investment. A student can pursue cooking course in oriental and western culinary in 3 years and only spend 50k and you dont have food expenses as all your meals are free. And you can immediately open your own business with only 5k as your capital. And that 5k can be recoup in less than few days. In fact your 50k investment already recoup in few months time. And while doing so, you dont have food expenses. As for those graduate in finance, engineering or whatever, they still need to eat and pay for it.

Posted by ganasai > 2016-01-10 12:04 | Report Abuse

dont use money to become everybody ambition. some really want become doctor, because this is their hobby and want to save a lot of people life. how uncle think, if he can help someone become doctor, and the doctor provide good and cheap medical service to people? this another way round. for me, i wont financial help those want become doctor, because they want earn more money. Sorry if i have money, i wont financial help them complete the study.

Posted by Humpreyliew > 2016-01-10 12:06 | Report Abuse

If making money is your main ambition to become a doctor then you are in wrong profession. You should instead pursue to become chinese doctor dispensing chinese herbs, you can make your money there.

Posted by ycbang > 2016-01-10 12:14 | Report Abuse

If no money,how to survive?

Posted by ks55 > 2016-01-10 12:15 | Report Abuse

Humpreyliew -- Are you sure your niece make 'so much' money as a junior doctor in UK?
Medical doctors even up to Consultant level still facing adequate compensation/ financial rewards. House officers (F1 and F2) after going through addition long period of specialist training (ST1 to ST9 number of years depends on Specialist field) to become a Medical Consultants may not earn more than a Financial Analyst.

Below is a grievance letter from a UK Consultant. So, please do not be upset if your STPM result is good and cannot admit to a medical course. Think big, and make the world your home.......

$$$$$$$$ Janis Burns
August 17 · London, United Kingdom ·

Dear Mr Gummer,

Thank you for taking time to respond to my letter. I addressed the letter to Mr. Cameron rather than yourself. While I appreciate your efforts I am more than disappointed that Mr. Cameron did not deem my letter regarding the NHS important enough to warrant a personal response, he certainly thought the NHS was important up until the ballot boxes closed on the 7th May 2015.

First of all, let me outline why I addressed the letter to Mr. Cameron rather than yourself. I did this because I have no confidence in Jeremy Hunt. I am not alone. I am sure you are aware of the petition "To debate a vote of no confidence in Health Secretary the Right Hon Jeremy Hunt". At the time of writing this petition has gathered 217,226 signatures. Therefore I would appreciate a response from our Prime Minister, I do hope you understand. However, as you have taken on this poisoned chalice I would like you to address several issues. I will also be writing, again, to Mr. Cameron and Mr. Hunt.

To be continued...........

Posted by ks55 > 2016-01-10 12:15 | Report Abuse

......I would like to draw your attention to a recent Freedom of Information request I made to the Department of Health regarding the number of consultants who currently opt out of weekend working (DE00000948196). The Department of Health was unable to tell me how many consultants opt out of weekend working. In his speech on 16 July 2015 “Making healthcare more human-centred and not system centred” Jeremy Hunt suggested that 6000 deaths a year are due to a lack of a consultant presence in hospital at weekends. You also suggest that in your response to me. Given that neither you, nor Jeremy Hunt nor the Department of Health can tell the UK public how many consultants actually opt out of weekend working, how on earth can you justify making such an inflammatory statement? This is completely unacceptable. You cannot back this statement up with fact. Please either have the courtesy to provide factual information to back up this claim or cease to make this claim.

Can you arrange for those responsible for this headline grabbing conclusion “6,000 people lose their lives every year because we do not have a proper 7-day service in hospitals” to explain clearly how they arrived at this conclusion? Many people are openly questioning this figure, see numerous post on various social media sites if you wish. You have a duty, as does Mr. Cameron and Mr. Hunt, to ensure that this emotive statement has been arrived at through robust interpretation of the data. Can you personally arrange for this information to be conveyed to not only myself, but the medical profession and the UK public please?

I think your statement regarding consultants who opt out of weekend working earning up to £200 an hour for working at the weekend is misleading. First of all, this work is being done in addition to their agreed job plan i.e. overtime. Of course consultants should be paid for providing non-emergency treatment in their own leisure time, particularly if this is to meet waiting list targets that cannot be achieved because the current system is under resourced. I assume you are referring to the National Audit Office report “Managing NHS Consultants”, if so then the figures you quote are based upon 97 Trusts that responded to the survey. Of the Trusts that responded with numerical figures (91) the average amount of additional work paid at standard rate was 19.2% and premium rate was paid for 10.2% of the additional work. Locally agreed rates were used to pay, on average, for 70.6% of the additional work performed by consultants. The average locally agreed hourly rate was reported by 46 of the 97 responding Trusts. The range was actually between £48 and £200 per hour, neither the mean, median nor mode rates of pay were reported. I agree that £200 an hour is more than excessive. You have done yourself a disservice by failing to adequately explain that these rates are essentially overtime payments and that you ought to have quoted the range rather than simply the headline grabbing figure of £200 per hour. Don’t you agree this would be a better and fairer approach to take?

Returning to Mr. Hunt’s speech, I would like to draw your attention to "This is not about increasing the total number of hours worked every week by any individual doctor. Doctors already work extremely hard, and their hours should always be within safe limits." I am over the proverbial moon that Mr. Hunt has gone on record with this. The contract submitted by NHS Employers to the DDRB did not include mandatory limits to doctors working hours, particularly the junior doctor contract. Are you and Mr. Hunt willing to offer assurances that you will mandate NHS Employers to include mandatory restrictions to working hours? The DDRB has supported this, the BMA wants this. Will you ensure this is enforced in any new contract? This must be a key priority for you and the Department of Health given your drive to ensure that patients remains safe in the NHS. I am sure you are very familiar with the contents of the most recent DDRB, please see page 37 of the report should you require further clarification on the DDRB’s recommendations.

To be continued........

Posted by ganasai > 2016-01-10 12:15 | Report Abuse

a lot of doctor earn money, especially the specialist one. but earn or not earn, should not be a reason for uncle to justify whether want to help or not. Uncle should justify based on family financial background, study result and why he/she want to become a doctor.

Posted by ks55 > 2016-01-10 12:16 | Report Abuse

........In your response to me, you state that I raised the issue of junior doctors’s pay. Yes I did. I also raised the issue of pay for all those who work in the NHS, not just doctors. i.e. nurses, allied health professionals, radiographers, porters and healthcare assistants. All those people, and many more besides, are essential to the NHS. You have chosen to focus solely on doctors’ pay in your response. Is there a reason you chose to ignore levels of pay for all those other people who I work with as part of the multi-disciplinary NHS team? This also needs to be addressed, can you provide a timescale for when this important matter will be tackled? I note the Institute of Fiscal Studies is concerned that by 2018 the level of public sector pay will have fallen to such levels that a repeat of the scenario in the early 2000s will occur. At this time parts of the public sector struggled to recruit and retain staff. Failure to tackle this in a pre-emptive fashion would surely be detrimental to your plans for the NHS, or is awarding a pay rises 2 years before a general election to the UK’s largest workforce part of the longer term Conservative plan to win a second term as a majority government? I would be surprised if this had not already crossed the mind of the astute Mr Osborne, it would certainly strengthen his move to be leader of your party.

Thank you for bringing up the 2014 DDRB. Have you actually read it? I’m not sure you have. In your response to my letter you state:

“In its 2014 report, the independent pay review body found that earning levels for junior doctors compare reasonably well with comparator groups at every stage of training.”

The 2014 DDRB report “Chapter 2: Economic and general considerations” is a particularly interesting and relevant read on this topic. I would like to refer you directly to paragraphs 2.20, 2.21, 2.22, 2.23, 2.24, 2.25 and 2.28.

The 2014 DDRB actually said that doctors’ and dentists’ earn less in real terms in 2013 than they did in 2002. Doctors’ and dentists’ previously tracked the 97th percentile, they are now approaching the 95th percentile. Pay for Doctors’ and dentists’ continues to fall behind comparator professions such as legal and actuarial. Basic pay for doctors and dentists in training is lower than for their comparator groups at the same stages. Although total earnings, which includes banding supplements, compare reasonably well with the comparator groups this results only because doctors work unsociable hours i.e. nights and weekends.

Also, the 2014 the DDRB stated that “the argument for an across-the-board uplift of 1 per cent in pay is compelling irrespective of the other features of the labour market for doctors and dentists.” (paragraph 10.14). This was not implemented in England. As a direct consequence doctors in Scotland now get paid more than those working in England. This was the recommendation of an Independent Review Body, yet the Department of Health chose to ignore it. As a Member of Parliament you have recently been awarded a massive pay rise, a little under £7000 per year. How can our Prime Minister go on record saying that "the right thing to do is to be paid the rate for the job" when his Government chooses to ignore the recommendations of one Independent Review Body but implement the recommendations of another? Do you seriously think your pay rise is justified when a modest 1 per cent pay rise for NHS staff has been blocked?

Hopefully you now realise that your simple statement fails to acknowledge the complexity of the situation and is misleading when taken out of context. I remind you of the comparison I made in my original letter, which you have completely ignored in your response. Doctors with their 5 year medical degree (and associated student debt), have a basic salary on the ST9 pay point (which equates to 11 years out of medical school with continuous service) have a basic salary of £47,175. To earn more than this that doctor has to work on average between 40 – 48 hours a week with one third of those hours at night and weekends. A TFL Tube Driver has a starting salary of £49,673 after 12 – 16 weeks of training. Currently they receive this for working 36 hours per week, although they do also work weekends, they have a greater than inflation annual pay rise and have an annual leave entitlement of 43 days, as a doctor my annual leave entitlement is 28 days. Would you care to make any comments upon how fair you think this is? Furthermore a newly qualified nurse (Band 5, Point 16) earns £21,692, is this fair? It is not.

To be continued........

Posted by ks55 > 2016-01-10 12:16 | Report Abuse

........The Conservative Party Manifesto 2015 included a section on “Protecting and improving our National Health Service”. Given the high entry requirements to study medicine, the length of the degree course and the associated high levels of student debt you would have to be an idiot to think that the proposed Junior Doctor contract submitted by NHS Employers will facilitate your pledge to protect the NHS. What are you going to do about this?

Also you mention that you plan to link pay progression for consultants to “responsibility, achievement and what they do for patients, not time served on the job”. Are you unaware that the 2014 DDRB pointed out in paragraph 2.38 that “Incremental pay progression with a strong link to performance needs to be grounded in a robust performance-based appraisal process.” and that “the 2012 NHS Staff Survey in England recorded that although the percentage of staff saying that they had received an appraisal in the last 12 months had increased for all staff groups, the percentage having a well-structured appraisal for all groups was below 50 per cent.” The DDRB concluded that this “suggests that there needs to be a major shift in the culture of the NHS to bring about an appraisal process that is fit for purpose.” Can you outline what steps the Department of Health has taken since this report to ensure a robust appraisal process is being introduced? I assume you have been working hard on this given this particular element seems to be central to your proposed contract reform.

Furthermore the proposed junior doctor contract proposes to link pay progression to taking up a post at the next level of responsibility, why are junior doctors not being offered a pay progression model that includes achievement and what they do for patients?

You have also ignored my statement regarding the introduction of mandatory safe staffing levels. Why would you ignore this, something that is fundamental to patient safety? What are your plans with respect to mandatory safe staffing levels?

Rather than yourself, I believe it is either Jeremy Hunt or David Cameron, who are best placed to outline exactly what comprehensive seven-day services are envisaged e.g. will this be outpatient services or elective operations? How do you plan to resource these additional services both in terms of finance and labour? You cannot and should not redistribute an already stretched work force to provide additional non-emergency services at the weekend, this will be detrimental to patient safety. Doctors cannot and do not work alone. We are part of the NHS team.

I whole-heartedly support a National Health Service that puts patient’s first and, as you acknowledge, I am already part of a team that provides a seven-day service, you even described it as outstanding. I do not support a continuing attack on my profession where you repeatedly make headline grabbing claims with facts that are taken out of context or, more worryingly, you are unable to back up. Please afford me the same courtesy as I have afforded you and respond to the issues I have raised rather than respond with the same rhetoric that I am questioning.

I look forward to hearing from you and hope you will be able to respond in a more timely fashion on this occasion,

Janis Burns

Posted by ks55 > 2016-01-10 12:32 | Report Abuse

Humpreyliew -- For your information, junior doctors in UK are grossly underpaid.

Junior doctor (F1 - F2) earning GBP 30k - 36K a year (all in)
Registrar (ST4 - ST9) earning GBP 50k - 80k a year (all in)
Consultant (after fellowship) earning in excess of GBP 90k a year.
Managers in NHS earning in excess of GBP 224k a year.

That is the reason UK junior doctors voted to go on strike next week.

####A strike by junior doctors is to go ahead next week after last-ditch talks over the health secretary’s plans to impose a new contract on them failed to break the deadlock, the negotiating service Acas has said.

While it called Friday’s negotiations constructive and said they would continue next week, a spokesman for Acas said they were not enough to avert the industrial action, which is due to start on Tuesday.

About 45,000 junior doctors in England voted overwhelmingly in favour of strike action and will provide only emergency cover......###
http://www.theguardian.com/society/2016/jan/08/junior-doctors-strike-to-go-ahead-after-talks-fail

Posted by chinaman > 2016-01-10 12:41 | Report Abuse

'nobleness' of doctors argument in jeopardy...ks55; you're spot on

Posted by mamatede > 2016-01-10 13:16 | Report Abuse

Walao when i read this article of discouraging people to take up doctor because of the poor pay etc. I was like wtf...

Posted by Humpreyliew > 2016-01-10 13:58 | Report Abuse

I know alot of Char Kueh Tiow parents who sent their children for medical degree. If a chef can sponsor his child one million medical degree course may as well become Char Kueh Tiow apek in the first place

Posted by murali > 2016-01-10 14:05 | Report Abuse

Penang Lorong Selamat Fried Kueh Teow Ah Soh with red cap make much more money than me full time selling roti part time goreng shares..

Posted by murali > 2016-01-10 14:12 | Report Abuse

Posted by Koon Bee > Jan 10, 2016 02:07 PM | Report Abuse

Hahahaha...that Amoi Char Kueh Tiow buying condo RM1.8 million in Quayside by E&O with cash...richer than a doctor in UK.

Wah Koonbee U knew her one ah? Next time can jump q by telling her yr name or not? Lazy waiting......

Posted by Desa20201956 > 2016-01-10 14:46 | Report Abuse

Koon
Very good letter to all young top students and their parents. Die die all are set to study medicine just because of peer pressures, and think that is their destiny and entitlement just because they scored full A.
Your letter is a very good reminder to them about the realities and tell them not to be unrealistic.
For top top students, Sunway and others already provide plenty of full scholarships for non medical studies. Together with PTPTN loans, these people should have no problem with money and also have a bright future as long as they drop their unrealistic goals to be doctors.
CSR and charity should focus on the upwards mobilities of poor students , not necessarily the top top students, and you have done it the right way.
If those top students with their A are not flexible, I don't think they have what it takes to be successful.

Posted by Desa20201956 > 2016-01-10 14:50 | Report Abuse

Students from poor families who are quite good, with Five A and above but without the opportunities offered to the top top students are the ones needing our help.

Posted by DingDongHai > 2016-01-10 14:54 | Report Abuse

Salute to all sifus.. Suggest KYY to list down cost for study char kueh teow in malaysia..

Posted by Probability > 2016-01-10 14:56 |

Post removed.Why?

Posted by yewyin33 > 2016-01-10 15:01 | Report Abuse

on the top of this article, you can see Manipal medical university is offering scholarships for the foundation course. It is giving a discount to capture more students. Its tuition fee is Rm 345,000. It is like the advertisement for condominium aircon and fridge are free of charge: Koon Yew Yin

Posted by Desa20201956 > 2016-01-10 15:05 | Report Abuse

I am totally with you, probability

When they are young and top top students, and the parents are from poor and middle class families, it is normal that all of them are brain washed into only wanting medicine, and nothing else.

Slaves to the system
Better are those above the system..and look down realistically.