Posted by CharlesT > 2018-11-24 07:10 | Report Abuse

No worries, u either make more or lose more only

Posted by lizi > 2018-11-24 08:56 | Report Abuse

bad market use margin meh? uptrend only use margin ma....low can go lower woh...

Posted by Alex™ > 2018-11-24 09:17 | Report Abuse

Lol. 5k fee hehe...

Revised: we need more commission, give us more money to give u fd rate return

Posted by paperplane > 2018-11-24 09:36 | Report Abuse

I know thw mkt Monday. Its either up or down

Posted by value88 > 2018-11-24 09:39 | Report Abuse

It is correct to use margin financing in bad market in order to capture the opportunity.
Using margin in bull market means buying more stocks at its peak price and that guarantee downfall.

Posted by value88 > 2018-11-24 09:43 | Report Abuse

I differentiate bear market into "small bear" and "big bear". Small bear means market down by >20% but less than 50%. Big bear means market down by >50% just like 1997/8 and 2008 crisis.

In big bear market, investor better sell every stocks and run even making a loss because there are a lot more to fall and the bear period will be long.
In small bear market, investor should accumulate undervalued stocks to capture opportunity and wait for better days ahead.

Posted by value88 > 2018-11-24 09:45 | Report Abuse

I think what happens now is small bear. Hope I am right..
Many analysts and economics also think we will not be in recession in coming one year. Hope they are right..

Posted by Flintstones > 2018-11-24 10:05 | Report Abuse

Very impressive Jon Choivo. You can manage your full time auditor job dabbling in the markets everyday?

Posted by Nelson Yoong > 2018-11-24 10:18 | Report Abuse

only use margin fund after market crash like early 1999 and end of
2008 and early 2009 but only person with experience and patient and no itchy finger,i already standby coupled of millions from maybank ready for next market crash (don`t kown when,akan datang)

Posted by newbie5354_ > 2018-11-24 10:21 | Report Abuse

Jon Choivo sifu can you elaborate name of the stocks referred? Is it SP Setia for property? Petrol retailer should be either HRC or Petron true? As for HRC so margin financing behind drop from RM 19?

It means, you can now buy property development companies that pay out dividends of effectively 24% per year at roughly 90-95% discount to revalued book value.

It means that the petrol retailer and refinery company is now selling at 1.5 times earnings or 66.7% earnings yield.

Posted by Nelson Yoong > 2018-11-24 10:23 | Report Abuse

hopefully market not like end 2000 to 2003,dripping slowly but big CRASH!!!

Posted by lizi > 2018-11-24 10:26 | Report Abuse

haha....newbie...

Posted by value88 > Nov 24, 2018 09:39 AM | Report Abuse

It is correct to use margin financing in bad market in order to capture the opportunity.
Using margin in bull market means buying more stocks at its peak price and that guarantee downfall.

Posted by CharlesT > 2018-11-24 10:46 | Report Abuse

If i were jon i will buy more airasia....jon is this what u r going to do?

Posted by CharlesT > 2018-11-24 10:49 | Report Abuse

At one time jon asked me to lend him money so that he can buy more airasia...i scared so i no reply pretending never see his message...

I no scare airasia no up but i scare airasia up but jon never pay me back only

Posted by newbie5354_ > 2018-11-24 10:53 | Report Abuse

Jon Choivo Maybank margin financing rate is 4.95%? How fast can get approval?

Posted by qqq3 > 2018-11-24 10:54 | Report Abuse

lizi..actually value88 and choi is perfectly correct

"It is correct to use margin financing in bad market in order to capture the opportunity.
Using margin in bull market means buying more stocks at its peak price and that guarantee downfall."

want to make some real money , want to make a name for yourself, must take some risk.....better still focus and sailang and margin at times....some more, margin during a hot market no use one.....sooner or later lose back every thing plus interest......margin at times like this, can keep the winnings.

Posted by qqq3 > 2018-11-24 11:00 | Report Abuse

Life is a gamble
Have guns will travel
the winners become emperors.

Posted by qqq3 > 2018-11-24 11:10 | Report Abuse

when losing money
must double down

that is what all great men do
including Baring Brothers
including Najib and 1 MDB....
including Warren the Buffalo.

lose become prisoners., win become emperors.

fair.

Posted by newbie4444 > 2018-11-24 11:15 | Report Abuse

qqq3 I thought you support KC Chong no margin financing method why here said different thing?

Posted by qqq3 > Nov 24, 2018 11:00 AM | Report Abuse
Life is a gamble
Have guns will travel
the winners become emperors.

Posted by qqq3 > 2018-11-24 11:19 | Report Abuse

u make me laugh only....because the reality is the direct opposite.


newbie4444 > Nov 24, 2018 11:15 AM | Report Abuse

qqq3 I thought you support KC Chong no margin financing method why here said different thing?

Posted by lizi > 2018-11-24 12:51 | Report Abuse

qqq, so far i have been very successful in sailang using margin during uptrend...same like doing business, u must know when to attack and when to defend...have some business sense plz.

Posted by paperplane > 2018-11-24 12:54 | Report Abuse

Tonite my lanjiao up and up, shiok shiok

Posted by sell > 2018-11-24 13:01 | Report Abuse

AA go holland? Why everyday drop?

Posted by 3iii > 2018-11-24 20:46 | Report Abuse

"There is simply no telling how far stocks can fall in a short period. Even if your borrowings are small and your positions aren't immediately threatened by the plunging market, your mind may well become rattled by scary headlines and breathless commentary."

But for a levelheaded investor who's not deep in debt during a market crash, there are "extraordinary opportunities," Buffett added.

In an interview with CNBC on Monday, Buffett suggested that greed was a primary driver of margin debt.

"Borrowing money is a way of trying to get rich a little faster, but there are plenty of good ways to get rich slowly," Buffett said. "And - you can - you can have a lot of fun while you're getting rich as well. My partner, Charlie, says that there's only three ways that a smart person can go broke. He says, 'liquor, ladies, and leverage.'"



https://www.google.com.my/amp/s/amp.businessinsider.com/warren-buffett-on-margin-debt-for-stocks-investing-2018-2

Posted by 3iii > 2018-11-24 21:18 | Report Abuse

https://www.gurufocus.com/news/703636/follow-warren-buffetts-advice-stay-away-from-debt-

Posted by qqq3 > 2018-11-24 21:30 | Report Abuse

lizi...then why u post....

Posted by lizi > Nov 24, 2018 10:26 AM | Report Abuse

haha....newbie...

Posted by value88 > Nov 24, 2018 09:39 AM | Report Abuse

It is correct to use margin financing in bad market in order to capture the opportunity.
Using margin in bull market means buying more stocks at its peak price and that guarantee downfall.

Posted by qqq3 > 2018-11-24 21:32 | Report Abuse

3iii...u worry too much.

Posted by qqq3 > 2018-11-24 23:56 | Report Abuse

for new kid on the block, wishing to establish the brand.....of course must be willing to do stuffs others do not do.

willing to hunt at the edges, not just happy to hunt in the middle.....

hunt at the edges where the grass is greener and can grow fat ( like Jho Low).....

Posted by Learner King > 2018-11-25 01:46 | Report Abuse

slowly and slowly finally this joker is reveal himself...as i always said his reason here is just to find a water fish and promote his fund. I wonder how many idiots invested into his fund until the next JJPTR case explode. Haha

Posted by 3iii > 2018-11-25 14:03 | Report Abuse

>>>>Posted by qqq3 > Nov 24, 2018 09:32 PM | Report Abuse

3iii...u worry too much.<<<<


Never. Sleeps very well.

But I am long term .... very very greedy. :-)

Posted by Jon Choivo > 2018-11-25 18:22 | Report Abuse

I'm no longer an auditor.

But oddly, i think i was much more hardworking back in the day when it came to stocks, rather than now, when i have comparatively more time.

I think its mainly because i've already all the annual reports in KLSE. So now, im more focused on expanding/refining my thinking and finding blind spots. Which comes from reading books that are not annual reports, meeting wiser people and living life a little more.

=====

Flintstones Very impressive Jon Choivo. You can manage your full time auditor job dabbling in the markets everyday?
24/11/2018 10:05

Posted by Jon Choivo > 2018-11-25 18:42 | Report Abuse

Haha CharlesT,

As you can see below, its a joke ;) I'm just going to assume things got lost in translation over the internet, instead of any malicious intent.

Having said that, i must thank you for saving me a couple thousand in JAKS-WR by reminding me its an order form. If not for you, i would have only found out potentially a few hours later or even a day after. Which would mean i was unlikely to have been able to sell it all for a small profit.

Allow me to return the favor by answer the Airasia question seriously.

Airasia is currently 2.41% of the fund. And i'm definitely open to increasing it to 5%-7% of the fund. However, this position increase is only after other positions are increased.

Which i should be able to with the financing in place.

The thing about airasia is, its an incredible business that was a pioneer in certain practices in the airline industry, which makes it currently, the airline with the lowest CASK in the industry, currently at 2.02 US Cents Ex-Fuel. This is compared to 2.34 US Cents Ex-Fuel back in 2014.

Given the standard inflationary pressure of about 4% per annum. This is utterly incredible. The last few years, they have maintained it around there.

What are some of the measures they did to get such low CASK?

The main one is when they pioneered the method of buying hundreds of planes upfront over a long period, enabling them to get in some cases 30-50% discounts and the ability to modify the planes to their own specs. They then leased these planes to their affiliate companies across ASEAN.

They bought the planes so cheap, that they can actually make a profit selling it AAC Aviation in the sale and leaseback. Which is almost reminiscent of the deal Sapura did with Seadrill on the floating rigs. Except in this case, Airasia, like Seadrill is getting the good end of the trade.

The sale makes sense for AAC because interest rates in the US is so low and in the reach for yield, airasia can probably give them an IRR of more than 7-10% on the planes, and still make a profit on the sale due to how cheaply they were bought.

I personally have no preference in regards to them holding the planes or not. But i'm leaning slightly to holding the planes.

The problem now for them is, this method of operation, is copied everywhere now, with many players ordering hundreds of planes upfront as well. So for once, AIRASIA will be having very serious competition from the likes of LION AIR etc.

But at a normalized PE of about 6-7 times earnings, and a big dividend coming up. One would argue it is more than priced into the current price of the company.

========
Nov 12, 2018 12:38 PM | Report Abuse

Sneaky jon doubled position at 2.71.

Price go holland mai go holland loh. We can go visit amsterdam smoke some pot.

Go from holland to africa also can. We can go visit lion and eat lion meat burger.

As long as investment thesis don't change, i can buy till 10% of portfolio. But bolui!

Unker, want sponsor my airasia position boh hahaha

========

CharlesT If i were jon i will buy more airasia....jon is this what u r going to do?
24/11/2018 10:46

CharlesT At one time jon asked me to lend him money so that he can buy more airasia...i scared so i no reply pretending never see his message...

I no scare airasia no up but i scare airasia up but jon never pay me back only
24/11/2018 10:49

Posted by 3iii > 2018-11-25 18:43 | Report Abuse

Jon Choivo

You should be spending 80% of your time reading about companies esp the annual reports.

20% of time spend on refining your philosophy and strategy is adequate.

Posted by Jon Choivo > 2018-11-25 18:44 | Report Abuse

You are not wrong. This was something i considered very deeply.

However, as you can see in my reasoning above, i think 30-40% margin is conservative enough.

I intend to constantly pare down the borrowings. When market gets hot, i expect the margin loan to be fully paid off and not utilized.



=====
3iii "There is simply no telling how far stocks can fall in a short period. Even if your borrowings are small and your positions aren't immediately threatened by the plunging market, your mind may well become rattled by scary headlines and breathless commentary."

But for a levelheaded investor who's not deep in debt during a market crash, there are "extraordinary opportunities," Buffett added.

In an interview with CNBC on Monday, Buffett suggested that greed was a primary driver of margin debt.

"Borrowing money is a way of trying to get rich a little faster, but there are plenty of good ways to get rich slowly," Buffett said. "And - you can - you can have a lot of fun while you're getting rich as well. My partner, Charlie, says that there's only three ways that a smart person can go broke. He says, 'liquor, ladies, and leverage.'"

Posted by Jon Choivo > 2018-11-25 19:34 | Report Abuse

I've spent my 80% far ahead of time. Haha

Does not mean i don't read any more. But its more on maintaining the database in brain for KLSE.

If i were to read in bulk again, ill probably start with SGX. Im currently at the letter "C" for it.

But its a more leisurely pace than last time for sure.

===
3iii Jon Choivo

You should be spending 80% of your time reading about companies esp the annual reports.

20% of time spend on refining your philosophy and strategy is adequate.
25/11/2018 18:43

Posted by Fabien Extraordinaire > 2018-11-26 14:41 | Report Abuse

Jon, noticed u kept asking ppl to put money in FD and China index.

what's ur intention, really? lol..

Posted by Jon Choivo > 2018-11-26 14:52 | Report Abuse

Haha yeah.

I don't think much explanation is needed. You yourself can observe the demographic and the quality of investors here. Its probably better for them.

I've recently sat down with a friend, whose family owns a brokerage in Malaysia. A quick hint, it has the lowest transaction cost around for cash. And he stated that less than 25% make any money. Those that beat FD, even less.

Even the US market retailers are flowing in bulk to ETF's and Indexes.

China index is also one of the best for the next 10-30 years imho. If you studied a little about human history and why some societies made it, as well as the securities markets there.

====
Fabien Extraordinaire Jon, noticed u kept asking ppl to put money in FD and China index.

what's ur intention, really? lol..
26/11/2018 14:41

Posted by Learner King > 2018-11-30 12:12 | Report Abuse

Dont dare to answer to my comments anymore ah? Joker or should i say Clown Jon Choivo...kakaka